Does the cheating involve a breach of trust? Then it's not good. If it's discussed and agreed about beforehand, all's well.
quote:
Xyrra stopped beating up furries long enough to write:
I've been on both sides of the issue.I've been cheated on, and cheated on the same person, years later. We stuck it out for a really long time, just to come to the realization that we weren't right for each other, and never would be, no matter what.
It hurted to cheat on someone.. it hurted to be cheated on as well. In the long run, it helped us both come to the realization to end the relationship. No harm, no foul. Neither of us were wrecked because of it.
I've also been involved in circumstances where it was discussed and agreed upon by both partners. It's strange. I don't think it would be something that I would do on a regular basis, but everyone involved had been friends for some time, and neither relationship suffered any harm.
Those are my experiences with it. I think the real problem with infidelity is the dishonesty, as opposed to the actual act.
*deposits her 2cp and walks out*
If it hurt to cheat, what caused you to do it?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
So quoth Lyinar Ka`Bael:
I guess that would come to down what you beleive constitutes happiness. Do you think people that are with numerous people are truly happy? Or do you think that the very fact they seek out so many means they are not content and whole themselves, and are still looking for their perfection?The same can be asked for exclusive relationships as well.
I think unhappiness can exist in both cases, but I know I'm happiest with one person. It's up to everyone else to find out what they like they most.
quote:
Everyone wondered WTF when The Burger wrote:
OOh, so you're saying that the singular emothin of love is more powerful than respect, affection, and friendship combined? Because those exist in many loveless marriages. And i'm not saying that duration and history are what's important, i'm just saying that your notion that love is all that is betrayed by infidelity is a tad naive.
Love, in my experience, includes respect, affection and friendship. So you have those ideals, plus love for the person on one side, and on the flip side is the respect, affection and friendship but without love on the other.
It's still a betrayal, but which would hurt worse?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Nicole had this to say about Jimmy Carter:
I'm keen on open relationships and open marriages, so the big issue for me isn't the cheating itself, but the trust involved.Does the cheating involve a breach of trust? Then it's not good. If it's discussed and agreed about beforehand, all's well.
That raises the question, though, that if you want other people, why are you with this person and not free to openly date and sleep with and whatever else you want?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Zaza had this to say about the Spice Girls:
I think unhappiness can exist in both cases, but I know I'm happiest with one person. It's up to everyone else to find out what they like they most.
So your view is that happiness can also exist in both, in addition to unhappiness?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
So your view is that happiness can also exist in both, in addition to unhappiness?
Yep. People differ way too much to fit happiness in relationships within a single clause, I think.
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael had this to say about Tron:
What if you're afraid? Or what if you have difficulty getting out? Do you think there's ever a time when abuse is involved that it's okay? Or do you think there's always a way to get out of it?
if you're in an abusive relationship, there are ALWAYS ways to get out, anywhere from talking to a friend and having them talk to the S.O. to talking to the cops and having then gang rape the S.O.
No, Really. Bite me.
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
I, however, thinking cheating, if not "allowed," is a sign of a failing relationship. If you can't get something with the one you're officially "with," there's probably many other shortcomings in your relationship.
And I just can't wrap my mind around the whole polyamory thing.
Well, actually, it just makes sense.
quote:
There was much rejoicing when Zaza said this:
Yep. People differ way too much to fit happiness in relationships within a single clause, I think.
To go back to cheating, are there any things we as a society could change to prevent it or cut back on it? Have we become lax, or is this just a changing of the times?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
The Burger had this to say about Cuba:
if you're in an abusive relationship, there are ALWAYS ways to get out, anywhere from talking to a friend and having them talk to the S.O. to talking to the cops and having then gang rape the S.O.
So for you, fear is not an excuse. Even when children are involved? What if the man or woman in the relationship cannot easily get away?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Crezia was listening to Cher while typing:
Honestly, humans weren't meant to be monogamous creatures. I mean, look at the various rest of the animals in the world. They all screw around, for the most part. The only truly monogamous creature is some little worm that fuses together when it mates.I, however, thinking cheating, if not "allowed," is a sign of a failing relationship. If you can't get something with the one you're officially "with," there's probably many other shortcomings in your relationship.
And I just can't wrap my mind around the whole polyamory thing.
There's plenty of animals that are monogamous, not just worms.
And cheating isn't always the sign of a failing relationship, it can just be a spur-of-the-moment idiocy, or maybe your partner is away for a few weeks, etc. [ 01-20-2003: Message edited by: Zaza ]
quote:
There was much rejoicing when Lyinar Ka`Bael said this:
To go back to cheating, are there any things we as a society could change to prevent it or cut back on it? Have we become lax, or is this just a changing of the times?
Cheating has always happened, will always happen. There's nothing to be lax about - it's a matter between the cheater and the cheated.
If anything should be worked on it's the prevention of violence related to cheating - murders are quite often commited out of jealousy, wheter real or imagined. Then again, it mostly happens in abusive relationships.
quote:
Crezia had this to say about pies:
Honestly, humans weren't meant to be monogamous creatures. I mean, look at the various rest of the animals in the world. They all screw around, for the most part. The only truly monogamous creature is some little worm that fuses together when it mates.I, however, thinking cheating, if not "allowed," is a sign of a failing relationship. If you can't get something with the one you're officially "with," there's probably many other shortcomings in your relationship.
And I just can't wrap my mind around the whole polyamory thing.
Why do you think humans aren't monogamous? There are many sets of animals that mate for life, such as dolphins, and wolves IIRC. Don't our closest relatives, primates, also mate for life? Maybe someone that has more animal kingdom knowledge than myself can shed some light on that.
And if cheating is a sign of something wrong, do you think it's worthwhile to try to work things out after it? Or is that it, the end, it's over?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Verily, »Giantt« doth proclaim:
I agree with Za like the good little sheep I am.Well, actually, it just makes sense.
Be nice, Giantt. No flames.
What makes you agree with him? Anything you disagree with?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Zaza impressed everyone with:
And cheating isn't always the sign of a failing relationship, it can just be a spur-of-the-moment idiocy, or maybe your partner or away for a few weeks.
If you care about your signifigant other enough, there's probably few situations short of rape that would stop a little flag that says, "This is not the right thing to do!" Or that's just my opinion. I couldn't be with anyone stupid enough to say "Ooops, sorry dear, I kinda slept with this girl I met at the grocery store this morning..."
And, as to missing partners: Masturbation. It was there before they were in your life and it's still more than happy to be there for you a bit longer.
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
So for you, fear is not an excuse. Even when children are involved? What if the man or woman in the relationship cannot easily get away?
If you decide to leave the relationship, there is NO excuse as to why you cannot. Other factors may make you decide not to leave, but they cannot make it impossible, unless you're physically imprisoned.
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
Crezia had this to say about Robocop:
If you care about your signifigant other enough, there's probably few situations short of rape that would stop a little flag that says, "This is not the right thing to do!" Or that's just my opinion. I couldn't be with anyone stupid enough to say "Ooops, sorry dear, I kinda slept with this girl I met at the grocery store this morning..."And, as to missing partners: Masturbation. It was there before they were in your life and it's still more than happy to be there for you a bit longer.
I strongly agree. I don't think there's such an excuse for cheating, but it's not always out of lack of being provided, so to say. [ 01-20-2003: Message edited by: Zaza ]
quote:
This one time, at Lyinar Ka`Bael camp:
That raises the question, though, that if you want other people, why are you with this person and not free to openly date and sleep with and whatever else you want?
Love. What all open marriages and open relationships need, that and a great, great deal of trust, communication, and honesty. People sometimes forget to figure in the love thing 
.
quote:
Crezia had this to say about Pirotess:
And, as to missing partners: Masturbation. It was there before they were in your life and it's still more than happy to be there for you a bit longer.
Just out of curiosity and as a non-sequiteur, what is the general female technique for masturbation?
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
This insanity brought to you by Lyinar Ka`Bael:
Why do you think humans aren't monogamous? There are many sets of animals that mate for life, such as dolphins, and wolves IIRC. Don't our closest relatives, primates, also mate for life? Maybe someone that has more animal kingdom knowledge than myself can shed some light on that.And if cheating is a sign of something wrong, do you think it's worthwhile to try to work things out after it? Or is that it, the end, it's over?
I honestly dunno where I got the worm comment from. Probably something I misheard somewhere; just disreguard it.
Cheating's one of many signs that things are wrong in the relationship and the people, such as domestic abuse is, or many other things. It's fixable, but like many problems, such as depression or alcoholism, the problem might not be as easy as it seems on the outside.
Not all relationships and all people can take the strain that cheating and its resolution produces, even if they want to.
quote:
Zaza had this to say about Reading Rainbow:
Cheating has always happened, will always happen. There's nothing to be lax about - it's a matter between the cheater and the cheated.If anything should be worked on it's the prevention of violence related to cheating - murders are quite often commited out of jealousy, wheter real or imagined. Then again, it mostly happens in abusive relationships.
If someone brought the idea of government paid and provided marriage counseling before all marriages, would you approve or disapprove?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Reynar stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
Speaking as someone who's been cheated on, I have zero tolerance for it, no matter what the excuse. Cheating = relationship is over for me, no questions asked.
None of the examples given or other examples you might be able to think of would make it okay in your book?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
[ 01-20-2003: Message edited by: Veruca Salt ]
quote:
How.... Crezia.... uughhhhhh:
If you care about your signifigant other enough, there's probably few situations short of rape that would stop a little flag that says, "This is not the right thing to do!" Or that's just my opinion. I couldn't be with anyone stupid enough to say "Ooops, sorry dear, I kinda slept with this girl I met at the grocery store this morning..."And, as to missing partners: Masturbation. It was there before they were in your life and it's still more than happy to be there for you a bit longer.
So for you, there is no mistake. It falls into the lap of the person, and it's their fault they weren't responsible?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
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Lyinar Ka`Bael wrote, obviously thinking too hard:
If someone brought the idea of government paid and provided marriage counseling before all marriages, would you approve or disapprove?
Disapprove. It'd only create people living together without being married.
quote:
The Burger stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
Just out of curiosity and as a non-sequiteur, what is the general female technique for masturbation?
Clitical.com. "Helping you reach the right spot." 
quote:
The Burger had this to say about Duck Tales:
If you decide to leave the relationship, there is NO excuse as to why you cannot. Other factors may make you decide not to leave, but they cannot make it impossible, unless you're physically imprisoned.
Is it still their fault if they decide to remain within the situation?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
Nicole was naked while typing this:
Love. What all open marriages and open relationships need, that and a great, great deal of trust, communication, and honesty. People sometimes forget to figure in the love thing.
If you love someone, why do you need other people? Do you think the person you're with should be your perfect match, the compliment to your personality? Or do you think that's impossible and we should all do the best we can with what we get? Settle, in other words.
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael got all f'ed up on Angel Dust and wrote:
So for you, there is no mistake. It falls into the lap of the person, and it's their fault they weren't responsible?
It can be a mistake. But not "An honest mistake." If you well and truly
wanted to remain faithful to him/her and you cheated, you were either A) drunk or B) at that moment, able to justify your actions in some way. If A -- you're allowed a tiny bit of leeway if you've never gotten drunk before, as you're clueless, which makes you stupid and do stupid things. If B -- if you can justify it once, what stops you from doing it again? Other than guilt, and guilt is not a healthy thing in a relationship.
quote:
Crezia had this to say about Duck Tales:
I honestly dunno where I got the worm comment from. Probably something I misheard somewhere; just disreguard it.Cheating's one of many signs that things are wrong in the relationship and the people, such as domestic abuse is, or many other things. It's fixable, but like many problems, such as depression or alcoholism, the problem might not be as easy as it seems on the outside.
Not all relationships and all people can take the strain that cheating and its resolution produces, even if they want to.
Do you think people should be expected to take the strain of cheating? Are they being strong to end things? Or are they being selfish?
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael had this to say about Knight Rider:
Do you think people should be expected to take the strain of cheating? Are they being strong to end things? Or are they being selfish?
Neither. They're being smart. Staying in a relationship that cannot be "fixed" post-cheating is sitting in a flaming traincar heading for a brick wall. One day, it's going to crash and it'll hurt. Bail out now.
quote:
Lyinar Ka`Bael stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
Is it still their fault if they decide to remain within the situation?
if you're in an abusive relationship, things won't magically get better, he won't stop beating the shit out of you because he suddenly sees the error of his ways, he will continue to pound the fuck out of you, until you leave. We live in the real world, so if you want the beatings to stop, either you leave, or get someone to take him out of the picture. If you decide to stay, it's partially your own fault.
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
The Burger was naked while typing this:
if you're in an abusive relationship, things won't magically get better, he won't stop beating the shit out of you because he suddenly sees the error of his ways, he will continue to pound the fuck out of you, until you leave. We live in the real world, so if you want the beatings to stop, either you leave, or get someone to take him out of the picture. If you decide to stay, it's partially your own fault.
It's not their fault that they're being beaten. It is their fault that they allow it to continue.
Tiny distinction, but a distinction nevertheless.
