quote:
Rodent King had this to say about Knight Rider:
All your ideas about persecuting pregnant women for smoking/drinking/hurting their unborn child in some way aren't really what this threads about. Women who care for their child won't hurt it. Women who don't really care should have the decency not to hurt a future human being. Just as we as people should have the decency not to kill a future human being.
It pays to make decisions based on the way things are, rather than the way they should be.
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Verily, »Waisztarroz« doth proclaim:
It's too late to make a save now.
Nuh-uh! 
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Verily, Delphi Aegis doth proclaim:
This man is the most intelligent being on the face of the earth.He has an opinion about something, but sees that he cannot force it upon others, so he continues having said opinion, but does not force it upon others.
Am I forcing anyone to listen? I've got just as much right to speak my thoughts here as they do to rebuke them. The rest of the boards have the same choice to get involved or even read these posts. Isn't there even a handy ignore button for anyone who really, REALLY doesn't like my ideas?
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We were all impressed when Rodent King wrote:
Am I forcing anyone to listen? I've got just as much right to speak my thoughts here as they do to rebuke them. The rest of the boards have the same choice to get involved or even read these posts. Isn't there even a handy ignore button for anyone who really, REALLY doesn't like my ideas?
Don't mind Delphi, he's just a little slow.
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Rodent King was naked while typing this:
Am I forcing anyone to listen? I've got just as much right to speak my thoughts here as they do to rebuke them. The rest of the boards have the same choice to get involved or even read these posts. Isn't there even a handy ignore button for anyone who really, REALLY doesn't like my ideas?
You argue the point when you have been (mostly) torn to shreds.
Archon just accepts that other people have an opinion, respects that, and moves on.
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MorbId had this to say about the Spice Girls:
It pays to make decisions based on the way things are, rather than the way they should be.
Which is why we're debating about legalizing abortions, not making smoking while pregnant a crime.
1) My body is not to play host to a parasite. Yep. That's how I see it.
2) If it can't survive outside the womb, it ain't a baby yet. Period. I'm not talking about preemies, who need a little extra care, I'm talking things that are no more than a clump of cells.
*deposits her 2cp and walks out of the thread*
For the woman who has an abortion to avoid psychological pain and complications, PAS.
After a long day and this whole deal i'm way too mentally tired to read and summarize it. So here, a link to a PAS support group thingy's faq.
http://www.afterabortion.com/faq.html
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Xyrra was listening to Cher while typing:
My views, which I do not expect anyone else to agree with:1) My body is not to play host to a parasite. Yep. That's how I see it.
2) If it can't survive outside the womb, it ain't a baby yet. Period. I'm not talking about preemies, who need a little extra care, I'm talking things that are no more than a clump of cells.
*deposits her 2cp and walks out of the thread*
Then don't have sex. 
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Rodent King's fortune cookie read:
Then don't have sex.
Excuse me, I'm going to ask everyone in the Chicago area to stop breathing to conserve oxygen for myself.
Don't breathe or you'll be morally in the wrong.
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Archon attempted to be funny by writing:
After a long day and this whole deal i'm way too mentally tired to read and summarize it. So here, a link to a PAS support group thingy's faq.
http://www.afterabortion.com/faq.html
Appeal to authority fallacy. If you've got a point to make, but you're too pooped, go to sleep and make it in the morning. It's OK. But just throwing a website at us and saying "refute THIS!" is is not a valid tactic, and in no way obliges us to consider your newest argument.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
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»Waisztarroz« was naked while typing this:
Excuse me, I'm going to ask everyone in the Chicago area to stop breathing to conserve oxygen for myself.Don't breathe or you'll be morally in the wrong.
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Rodent King had this to say about Knight Rider:
Then don't have sex.
I would ask if you were part of the Church in some way... but history shows that even that doesnt stop the Basic Instincts And the just freakish ones too 
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Rodent King had this to say about dark elf butts:
All your ideas about persecuting pregnant women for smoking/drinking/hurting their unborn child in some way aren't really what this threads about. Women who care for their child won't hurt it. Women who don't really care should have the decency not to hurt a future human being. Just as we as people should have the decency not to kill a future human being.
Well, i'll try to reiterate it such that it does seem a bit more relevant to the topic.
You stipulate that an unborn child, from fertilization, is a human being, and thus subject to the right to life.
Since this being has the right to life, we should not murder it, because the would violate it's right to life.
I am saying that IF it is a human being, then it must have ALL the human rights. This includes the right to life, as well as the right to security of the person.
Since it has the right to security of person, it should be illegal for the mother to do anything that could cause harm to it, or through inaction, cause harm to it. Therefore, drinking should be prohibited for pregnant women. Strenuous activity should be prohibited in pregnant women in their third trimester, etc...
A implies B implies C, but since C is flawed, B must be flawed, and since B is flawed, A must be flawed...
No, Really. Bite me.
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Xyrra wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
My views, which I do not expect anyone else to agree with:1) My body is not to play host to a parasite. Yep. That's how I see it.
2) If it can't survive outside the womb, it ain't a baby yet. Period. I'm not talking about preemies, who need a little extra care, I'm talking things that are no more than a clump of cells.
*deposits her 2cp and walks out of the thread*
Whether you continue in the discussion or not, these are some valid view points. I feel, though, that #2 is hardly fair. The womb could be compared in function to a life-support machine. If someone is in an accident and wont live without medical attention, does that mean he is no longer a life? Does that mean we shouldn't bother?
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Rodent King's account was hax0red to write:
All your ideas about persecuting pregnant women for smoking/drinking/hurting their unborn child in some way aren't really what this threads about. Women who care for their child won't hurt it. Women who don't really care should have the decency not to hurt a future human being. Just as we as people should have the decency not to kill a future human being.
That is the most unutterably stupid comeback I have seen thus far, RK. Let's take a closer look!
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My point on the drug and alcohol issue is not that the women are trying to kill their unborn-children, but that since you're pushing the right to life onto an as yet unborn person, it is only logical that they would also have the righ to security of person, and should not be subjected to harm, were it avoidable.
You didn't touch this. People are prosecuted for harming others. If I beat the shit out of you, you'd take me to court for assault and battery. If I poisoned you, you'd take me to court and legally, you'd win because I was deliberately causing you harm.
On the same hand, the law states that if you kill someone, you're held accountable. By trying to outlaw abortion, you're trying to get that same stigma applied to an unborn child, under the assumption that that unborn child is a human as well. You speak for him, you said so yourself.
So why do you not speak for him when his mother abuses HER body and fucks up his? Why are you so adamant he should live, yet you take a backseat stance on smoking/drinking during pregnancy? Yes, we SHOULD do this but we don't. You're not nearly as adamant on this as you are on the abortion stance. If you're all for one, why not the other? Isn't that rather hypocritical?
As you say, women who don't really care should have the decency not to hurt a future human being. Drinking/smoking can kill an unborn child too. Guess what? That's where you step in! You're pro-life, yes? So start legislating making it illegal to smoke or drink if pregnant! Choices and decency be damned, if you're going to try to outlaw one way to kill an unborn kid (abortion) then it'd be hypocritical not to be just as gung-ho against another way to kill an unborn kid (Screwing your body with alcohol, cigarettes, and drugs). [ 11-17-2002: Message edited by: Khyron ]
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So quoth »Waisztarroz«:
Excuse me, I'm going to ask everyone in the Chicago area to stop breathing to conserve oxygen for myself.Don't breathe or you'll be morally in the wrong.
You ladies want some fun?
Oral,(I'm not gonna get into the other stuff, use your imaginations.)
You want sex without the baby? Use protection.
Be on the pill, wear a condom, take a morning-after pill, use the timing-method.
All those choices didn't work for you? Life gave you a crappy hand, don't take it out on your baby.
In the end, there's a whole lotta ways to not get pregnant and still have fun.
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Rodent King had this to say about Matthew Broderick:
You want sex without the baby? Use protection.Be on the pill, wear a condom, take a morning-after pill, use the timing-method.
Protection doesnt always work, dude.
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Khyron's account was hax0red to write:
So why do you not speak for him when his mother abuses HER body and fucks up his? Why are you so adamant he should live, yet you take a backseat stance on smoking/drinking during pregnancy? Yes, we SHOULD do this but we don't. You're not nearly as adamant on this as you are on the abortion stance. If you're all for one, why not the other? Isn't that rather hypocritical?
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From the book of Rodent King, chapter 3, verse 16:
There's not an epidemic of women trying to smoke and drink their child to death.
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Rodent King enlisted the help of an infinite number of monkeys to write:
You ladies want some fun?Oral,(I'm not gonna get into the other stuff, use your imaginations.)
You want sex without the baby? Use protection.
Be on the pill, wear a condom, take a morning-after pill, use the timing-method.
All those choices didn't work for you? Life gave you a crappy hand, don't take it out on your baby.
In the end, there's a whole lotta ways to not get pregnant and still have fun.
Most of those don't work so well. The timing method is probably the most useless.
The morning after pill is...gasp...killing a baby!
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Archon Model 2000 was programmed to say:
I hate to step out, because i really feel like i'm the only one debating on my side of the issue. But i'm so tired, i think if i keep going i'll say something stupid that would cause more damage than just stepping out. It's been fun though. I always feel good after a big correctly presented and countered debate. G'night!
i'll probably do that soon, sleep well, and hope the thread's still unlocked in the morning. Sleep well.
No, Really. Bite me.
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Pesco's fortune cookie read:
Protection doesnt always work, dude.
I forsee a response from RK involving one of two things:
"Then don't have sex"
or
"It's not your fault a random chance got you pregnant, don't take it out on your baby"
He's predictable, it's almost silly. 
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Everyone wondered WTF when Rodent King wrote:
You ladies want some fun?Oral,(I'm not gonna get into the other stuff, use your imaginations.)
You want sex without the baby? Use protection.
Be on the pill, wear a condom, take a morning-after pill, use the timing-method.
Or you could just have an abortion.
(Someone was going to say it.)
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Pesco enlisted the help of an infinite number of monkeys to write:
Protection doesnt always work, dude.
It's a risk, just like having sex is a risk that your partner's got STD's. You can avoid the risk all together and still have fun by not physically doing the deed. Do I really need to go through all the ways I know of to get off without intercourse?
The protection's there because some people really, REALLY like sex. But then you take that risk.
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Delphi Aegis had this to say about Knight Rider:
I forsee a response from RK involving one of two things:"Then don't have sex"
or
"It'snotyour fault a random chance got you pregnant, don't take it out on your baby"He's predictable, it's almost silly.
Fixed that for you.
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This insanity brought to you by »Waisztarroz«:
The morning after pill is...gasp...killing a baby!
What exactly IS the morning after pill? How does it work? I PROMISE i'll go to bed after this one heh
Edit: This would be a good point to say that i do not perceive contraceptives the same as abortion. I don't believe in pre-martial sex, but i strongly believe in contraceptives. If life isn't given the chance to start, how can it be murder? [ 11-17-2002: Message edited by: Archon ]
'Til then! 'Twas fun! 
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
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Rodent King obviously shouldn't have said:
Fixed that for you.
You were still predictable, kthx
And it isn't your fault you protected yourself and via some weird, silly chance, all those contraceptives didn't work, it's random luck.
Of course, if you were a turbo-christian, you'd say something about god there, but you've been good on that bit.
The morning after pill basically prevents the fertilized egg from implanting on the wall of the uterus... er, however that's spelled.
Whee~
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Archon had this to say about Captain Planet:
What exactly IS the morning after pill? How does it work? I PROMISE i'll go to bed after this one heh
it forces a woman's body to sluff off the uterean lining, effectively forcing her to go through a menstrual cycle out of timing. Withoug the uterean lining, the fertilized egg has no place to attach itself and thus never devellops beyond a single cell. Without the uterean lining to attach the cell to, it cannot divide, and is expelled from the body in due time.
No, Really. Bite me.
[ 11-17-2002: Message edited by: Tegadil ]
*passes out on his keybo65 6509jm g0hmpoghkd
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Rodent King thought this was the Ricky Martin Fan Club Forum and wrote:
It's a risk, just like having sex is a risk that your partner's got STD's. You can avoid the risk all together and still have fun by not physically doing the deed. Do I really need to go through all the ways I know of to get off without intercourse?The protection's there because some people really, REALLY like sex. But then you take that risk.
No.. protection is there for people that want to spend some intimate time with their significant other and running a much higher chance of not ending in pregnancy. By using protection, people ARE showing a level of resposibility and maturity. They realize that they are not ready for children and are taking precautions to prevent that.
Are you trying to tell me that married couples that arent ready for kids arent allowed to have sex even though they are trying their best to make sure nothing results from it other then them being a married couple?
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Tegadil had this to say about Robocop:
Whoah, accidentally hit post a lil early there...
Rofl, a little? My opinion:
Ok, yeah, i'm sleeping.
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Karnaj Model 2000 was programmed to say:
RK's 'arguments' are getting repetitive.
I agree. I think the whole debate thing's over. I've said my stuff, you've all said your stuff, nobody's changed sides; that pretty much explains most debates.
It's now 2:13 in Chicago, meaning that sleep is needed to get up later on today. G'night.
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When the babel fish was in place, it was apparent Tegadil said:
Whoah, accidentally hit post a lil early there...
And here I thought you were just being funny.
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From the book of Rodent King, chapter 3, verse 16:
There's not an epidemic of women trying to smoke and drink their child to death.
quote:
In 1999, an estimated 17 percent of pregnant women smoked cigarettes in the past month, and 3 percent of pregnant women engaged in "binge" alcohol use.Among women aged 15 to 44 who were currently pregnant, about 17 percent reported the use of one or more tobacco products (cigarettes, smokeless tobacco, cigars, or pipes) in the past month (Table 1). Cigarettes were the most widely used tobacco product, with an estimated 416,000 pregnant women smoking cigarettes in the past month.
What constitutes an epidemic?
416 thousand pregnant women abusing their bodies with cigarettes alone?
Add in another 3%, and thats another 73 thousand woman fucking up their kids with alcohol.
So how many thousands more do you need before you consider it an 'epidemic'?
