I saw this trailer when I was going to see Harry Potter and I damn near shat myself just because it was a 2D Disney movie, then like 30 seconds in they cut to the live action bullshit.
Why is it such a sin to make a movie without fucking CG anymore? Is there really no place in the animation world for regular artwork? I don't care how bad or how cliche a new 2D movie would be, as long as they would just make it.
I remember every Disney movie that came out when I was a kid I loved and was amazed by the stories they told and as I grew older I appreciated the art style of the Disney animators just as much as the movie itself. Now, I mean the movies aren't all terrible (most are), but it's like the CG thing was cool when A Bugs Life came out and ever since then it just keeps rolling down hill.
Not really going anywhere with this. Just a rant.
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
quote:
Skaw had this to say about pies:
Hand drawn cel by cel animation is pretty much becoming a thing of the past. Flash is being used in place of it a lot lately, for animated shows.
Which is ugly as shit too. I'm gonna blame this on Michael Eisner who doesn't care about making masterpieces anymore, just money and nothing but. Mr. Gainsborough fucked around with this message on 07-18-2007 at 01:12 AM.
quote:
Kegwen stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
hand drawn is expensive, slow, and kids don't care
quote:
Gains stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
doesn't care about making masterpieces anymore, just money and nothing but.
I know it's the truth, but it's still depressing. Mr. Gainsborough fucked around with this message on 07-18-2007 at 01:37 AM.
quote:
Mr. Gainsborough painfully thought these words up:
I know it's the truth, but it's still depressing.
i think masterpiece status has more to do with the writing than anything else really but what do I know
quote:
Maradon! probably says this to all the girls:
There's always anime
I like it as much as the next weeaboo, but seriously now.
just no. 
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
I'm looking at you, George Lucas.
quote:
Mortious stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
CGI has ruined many things that otherwise could've rocked, not only cartoons.I'm looking at you, George Lucas.
For serious. Star Wars lost nearly all it magic using CGI... nothing beats scale x-wing models packed with firecrackers.
quote:
The logic train ran off the tracks when Mortious said:
CGI has ruined many things that otherwise could've rocked, not only cartoons.I'm looking at you, George Lucas.
Really? I thought it could have been the weak characters, cliched plots and ridiculous conflicts.
quote:
Mr. Parcelan said:
Really? I thought it could have been the weak characters, cliched plots and ridiculous conflicts.
George Lucas ruined them by directing them and over-controlling them to the point of being obsessive compulsive about every line and every scene.
Star Wars was best when Lucas couldn't be in two places at once and had to hire co-directors to do most of the work. Arguably the best Star Wars (Empire Strikes Back) was barely directed by Lucas at all. He SUCKS at directing.
Some of the best lines in Empire were not even in the script. Most notably the "I love you." "I know.." exchange between Leia and Han before he's frozen in carbonite. Ford was supposed to say "I love you too.", which wouldn't have been nearly as good, he changed the line on the fly and they ran with it. Lucas wouldn't allow that these days.
Mark Hamill went on to be a pretty awesome voice actor, too.
WHAT HAVE YOU DONE, CHRISTIAN HAYDENSEN?!
quote:
Mr. Gainsborough had this to say about Pirotess:
Which is ugly as shit too. I'm gonna blame this on Michael Eisner who doesn't care about making masterpieces anymore, just money and nothing but.
I thought they kicked Eisner out? Peter fucked around with this message on 07-18-2007 at 09:49 AM.
The downsides to George Lucas's pipe dreams were numerous, like when all of a sudden Carrie Fisher started faking an English accent on the bridge of the Death Star, or all the god damn midgets, or all the pointless and random video game conflicts (as Parcelan said). The best part of the original series was probably the fact that George Lucas had not yet developed a case of dementia, and Mark Hamill's acting. In fact, George Lucas is a big ole douche. Knights of the Old Republic was like Star Wars without him, and it was 5 times less cheesy (although Bioware attempted to gay it up with their annoying scripts and voice acting). Stalwart Steve fucked around with this message on 07-18-2007 at 10:48 AM.
"Don't want to sound like a fanboy, but I am with you. I'll buy it for sure, it's just a matter of for how long I will be playing it..."
- Silvast, Battle.net forums
quote:
Kegwen wrote, obviously thinking too hard:
i think masterpiece status has more to do with the writing than anything else really but what do I know
You can't just take the writing alone. Beauty and the Beast wouldn't have been nearly as much of a masterpiece without the beautiful animation backing up a well-told story.
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
BUT PRAISE JESUS JAR JAR WAS ALIVE AT THE END
"Don't want to sound like a fanboy, but I am with you. I'll buy it for sure, it's just a matter of for how long I will be playing it..."
- Silvast, Battle.net forums
Boba Fett didn't actually die, but that's an extended universe factoid and probably non-canon.
It never actually shows him dying, he just gets the bendis treatment.
That having been said...
You can't assail CGI. Keep in mind that the vast majority of films such as 300, Sin City, Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow, the Lord of the Rings movies, etc, were filmed using either almost completely CGI backgrounds, or making use of a vast amount of CGI work.
Likewise, you COULD NOT HAVE ANY of the major superhero movies we've had lately without CGI. Not even Batman Begins. The X-Men movie was in on-and-off production for literally decades but they couldn't do it right. Something like 75% of the time you see Spider-Man on the big screen, he's either completely CGI or he's being touched up with CGI. Don't even get me started on big CGI productions like the Hulk movie or Superman (and those movies did badly because of poor writing, not because the CGI was bad). You also couldn't have fun popcorn flicks like Starship Troopers, or TV series like Firefly without cheap, easily-accessible CGI.
Now as far as ANIMATED features are concerned, there are some that plain look better as computer generation. I saw the Buzz Lightyear cartoon. I much preferred him computer-rendered. Likewise, Monsters Inc, likewise Incredibles, likewise Over the Hedge, likewise The Wild. Do I think it gets overused? Yes. I will agree that sometimes it gets overused, or it looks bad. But that's bad craftsmanship and implementation. It is not a matter of "all CGI = Bad".
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
Case in point: LOTR vs Star Wars prequels. One made extensive use of properly built sets and miniatures, the other did not. Which one was a box office hit and which one was crap? I rest my case.
And as has been said...Star Wars bombed for reasons OTHER than the CGI. Lucas screwed Star Wars up with over-controlling direction and so forth. Ja'Deth Issar Ka'bael fucked around with this message on 07-19-2007 at 09:21 PM.
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
quote:
Mortious was listening to Cher while typing:
.Case in point: LOTR vs Star Wars prequels. One made extensive use of properly built sets and miniatures, the other did not. Which one was a box office hit and which one was crap? I rest my case.
Star Wars prequels would have been awesome if Lucas hadn't directed them and had help from more talented writers. Where in the hell did you get the idea that of all the things wrong with the prequels, it was the CGI that ruined them? The visuals were fine, it was the content that the visuals were supporting that sucked
quote:I do feel there is some sort of realism lost when studios favor CGI over props/models. But in this day and age, you'd be foolish not to take CGI. It's what people expect and are comfortable with, now.
Kegwen.
Star Wars prequels would have been awesome if Lucas hadn't directed them and had help from more talented writers. Where in the hell did you get the idea that of all the things wrong with the prequels, it was the CGI that ruined them? The visuals were fine, it was the content that the visuals were supporting that sucked
However, Kegwen has a good point. Episodes 1 - 3 were shit because Lucas surrounded himself with yes-men and let his ego take control.
quote:
Kegwen wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
Star Wars prequels would have been awesome if Lucas hadn't directed them and had help from more talented writers. Where in the hell did you get the idea that of all the things wrong with the prequels, it was the CGI that ruined them? The visuals were fine, it was the content that the visuals were supporting that sucked
This is what I would go with. Personally I thought the visuals were the only "cool" thing about the movies. Seeing all the StarWars stuff ramped up.(Cept Yoda. Yoda just inspired laughter from me. I think he would have been better served staying a debilitated puppet.)
Hell the whole "Mystery" behind the force from Ep1 and the Midiclorifuckwhatevers, was just like "Wait, what the fuck??" totally destroyed the whole "Use the force Luke!" Moments from the originals.
Even then I wouldn't say it was all the writing. It was the directing and the fucking godawful cast. Liam only sucked because of the script, and even as bad as the scripts were Ewan managed to salvage his parts somewhat because he is an awesome actor. Everyone else was just plain sad, either from being director hadicapped or from just plain sucking. (Ahem, Jake Lloyd/Hayden Christensen)
If he'd gone with models supported by CGI backgrounds, like LOTR did, I would've been happier.
Yes it looked cool, but I couldn't tell what the fuck was happening or why I should give two fucks. The entire battle was being fought by clones with no hint of humanity, or robots, so I couldn't care less if someone died or something exploded. It didn't help that it was the cold open for the movie.
Compare it's emotional impact to the battle of Endor.
quote:
There was much rejoicing when Blindy. said this:
Compare it's emotional impact to the battle of Endor.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
quote:
Blindy. said:
The battle over Coruscant was simply information overload.Yes it looked cool, but I couldn't tell what the fuck was happening or why I should give two fucks. The entire battle was being fought by clones with no hint of humanity, or robots, so I couldn't care less if someone died or something exploded. It didn't help that it was the cold open for the movie.
Would've been better if they'd cut to Star Destroyer bridges at some points ala Empire Strikes Back. That gave them more life instead of "oh hay here's a Star Destroyer with no one in it".
Whose supposed to be making these 2d epics these days?
quote:
Mr. Parcelan must think they're pretty smart:
Stuff
Note I didn't say the battle ON Endor.
quote:
Elvish Crack Piper probably says this to all the girls:
Didn't Disney get rid of most of its hand drawn animation studio equipment?Whose supposed to be making these 2d epics these days?
Treasure Planet's failure was a leading cause in Disney's choice to move away from traditional animation into 3d Animation. Sad really, but there are a number of examples of one or two movies ruining a studio or outright bankrupting them.
Also with the Pixar deal and them becoming joined at the hip with Disney, that didn't help either.
I'm with Gains on this one. I miss traditional animation, even though I still love the stuff Pixar puts out.
There's still always Don Bluth, assuming he ever recoveres from Titan AE (Which was also laced with CGI. I actually LIKED Titan AE though. ). Supposedly "Dragon's Lair" is penned and ready for the big screen.
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Faelynn LeAndris thought this was the Ricky Martin Fan Club Forum and wrote:
Which was also laced with CGI.
Which was used as a backdrop, a supplement to the hand-drawn characters, and was overall a boon. Unlike Disney.
