quote:
Drysart impressed everyone with:
Come on down to S-U8A4
I prefer not to get gangbanged by 100 odd goons 
ben(at)netmastering(dot)nl
quote:
Falaanla Marr had this to say about Duck Tales:
Created Saetha. god this tutorial is long as shit.Please tell me this boring as hell tutorial is in no way, shape or form indicative of the quality of the game. I'm still only halfway through it.
It's pretty similar overall, unless you just skip from typical play to PvP play with rich and experienced people to support you.
Pretty much what Mort said in responce to Sean's saying he played the tutorial and got bored. Faelynn LeAndris fucked around with this message on 05-31-2006 at 09:45 PM.
quote:
Faelynn LeAndris spewed forth this undeniable truth:
It's pretty similar overall, unless you just skip from typical play to PvP play with rich and experienced people to support you.Pretty much what Mort said in responce to Sean's saying he played the tutorial and got bored.
It's hard to explain. The game seems fun, problem comes in with how damn long the tutorial takes more than anything
On the other hand, considering there's a decent amount of EC'ers in game, I'd suggest skipping the tutorial and asking someone if you dunno what to do.
And for fucks sake, don't start training up battlecruisers, buy one, don't insure it, put small t1 guns on it and think you're going to live in lowsec space... because you won't. And it'll cost you. Big. Even more if I'm the one who starts shooting at you 
ben(at)netmastering(dot)nl
quote:
Falaanla Marr thought this was the Ricky Martin Fan Club Forum and wrote:
I'm following the goonfleet guide. Gonna play with them once i slog through the tutorial. also trained up to Frigate 4 to start like recommended.
Good boy. You're doing the right thing. Hangin with the Goon crew will get you a pretty damned good start in EvE. I don't think BoB likes them much 
PvP and rich corp experiences are what the game is really about, unless you really enjoy doing carebear stuff. I like a mix of the two, mostly the agent carebear whoring to fund me doing something more fun.
quote:
Falaanla Marr came out of the closet to say:
It's hard to explain. The game seems fun, problem comes in with how damn long the tutorial takes more than anything
EVE has a very steep initial learning curve. The tutorial, as long as it is, only scratches the surface of the stuff you'll learn in your first few days.
quote:
Drysart had this to say about Optimus Prime:
EVE has a very steep initial learning curve. The tutorial, as long as it is, only scratches the surface of the stuff you'll learn in your first few days.
But at least I'm going to be with a crowd that knows their shit so it shouldn't be THAT bad.
...and the tutorial seems broken. Trying to get it to let me do the jump into deadspace thing after I kill off the pirates around the gate. But it won't let me activate the gate and I get no sort of error message when I try to :/ Falaanla Marr fucked around with this message on 06-01-2006 at 10:59 AM.
Cos it looks neat, and after hours upon hours of WoW, I need some eye candy. 
Approaching stargate. Autopilot jumping.
Autopilot disabled, no waypoint set.
It's not something people hear about.
quote:
This one time, at Delphi Aegis camp:
Looking at the training view of this, is Eve the sort of thing you can play for a half hour or an hour each day and leave it alone and still make appreciable progress?Cos it looks neat, and after hours upon hours of WoW, I need some eye candy.
Yeah you can. You'll be able to train skills while not at your keyboard, but earning money is another matter. You still need to have some cash to be able to have fun in the game. Of course you could just sell time cards on the forums.
And yes the auto piolet is annoying as hell.
And Fal has gotten further in the tutorial than I ever did. Back when I started it was just shooting the roid and the training drone thing, then sending me to an agent to earn iskies.
quote:
Naimah said:
If larger ships can't do anything to the faster ships, why are the larger ships pupular?
Let me put it this way.
Someone has a good webber or some T2 light drones? Bye bye interceptor. They're still fragile as all hell.
quote:
Mortious spewed forth this undeniable truth:
Let me put it this way.Someone has a good webber or some T2 light drones? Bye bye interceptor. They're still fragile as all hell.
Just a regular crusier locking onto my slow as balls destroyer will send me to the repair shop after warping out
quote:
Mortious's account was hax0red to write:
Let me put it this way.Someone has a good webber or some T2 light drones? Bye bye interceptor. They're still fragile as all hell.
Yeah. I have more deaths in interceptors than in any other type of craft. On the flipside, I also have more kills in interceptors than any other type of craft.
quote:
Naimah came out of the closet to say:
If larger ships can't do anything to the faster ships, why are the larger ships pupular?
Combat in EVE is very, very complex. There's a lot that figures in.
Turrets have a maximum tracking speed (radians/sec) that they can move to follow another ship to shoot at it. They also have optimal distances -- if the target is too far away, you can't hit them. If they're too close, you can't track fast enough (closer = higher transversal velocity at lower speeds).
Missiles don't have a tracking speed, but the missiles have a maximum velocity and maximum flight time. They also have a certain explosion radius. If the explosion radius is larger than the ship it's hitting, most of the damage from the explosion goes harmlessly off into space. If the ship is travelling faster than the missile's explosion velocity away from you, not all of the force of the explosion hits the ship.
Thusly, avoiding damage from a missile boat requires completely different maneuvering than avoiding damage from a turret boat.
Smaller ships have higher survivability because of their speed and size, but because of their size, they can't fit weapons that are as big, so they do less damage. Plus, like any ship, they can be "webbed", which slows down their velocity and makes them much much easier to hit.
A good fleet has a mix of large and small ships. The small ships tend to run support roles for the larger ships... "debuffing" the enemy ships to allow the fleet's larger ships to dish out their damage more effectively.
Somewhere on the EVE site there are tutorials on how the different weapon types work along with incredibly complicated, interactive graphs that you can use to see exactly how the weapons work under different conditions. Drysart fucked around with this message on 06-01-2006 at 05:39 PM.
quote:
Sean came out of the closet to say:
Autopilot engaged. Approaching stargate. Autopilot jumping.Approaching stargate. Autopilot jumping.
Autopilot disabled, no waypoint set.
When you get into 0.0, you'll likely never use your autopilot again, since travel in 0.0 space requires a lot more paranoia and different tactics for approaching gates and stations.
quote:
nem-x came out of the closet to say:
The first week of eve seems like its going to be sadface.
I can't participate well in pvp because I don't have my trapping skills filled, and I can't do the missions because I need to train diplomacy to lessen the faction hits.
Don't worry about the faction hits from doing the Intaki Space Police missions. You need to do a ton of the missions before it hurts your faction to the point that it becomes a bother for you. There's a level 1 Expert Distribution agent nearby that you can use, and should as soon as possible. (If you're Caldari, you can start doing the ED missions right away.) Drysart fucked around with this message on 06-01-2006 at 05:43 PM.
It's not something people hear about.
Instant Recall, for example, is nowhere on my list, so I moved down a bit and grabbed two ranks of Iron Will and some other stuff.
It's not something people hear about.
quote:
nem-x came out of the closet to say:
I don't know what the fuck are instas and whatever either.
Ok, here's instas explained:
Every time you warp to a target, the nearest you can actually warp is 15km away. Even in a frigate, it takes you a good 30 seconds or more to approach the target from that distance.
In addition to being able to warp to celestial objects (like stargates and stations), you can also warp to bookmarked locations out of your bookmark list. Those work the same way, you warp 15km away from the actual location.
So, what people do is place bookmarks 15km behind stargates and stations -- so when you warp to the bookmark, it drops you right on top of the gate or station, allowing you to instantly jump or dock.
Goonfleet has good insta bookmark sets for the pipe (the trail from S-U up to empire space and back), for Syndicate (the entire region S-U is in), and for the ED missions (instas to all the various places those missions will send you).
Right now, instas are almost required for travel in 0.0 because of the amount of time it takes you to approach a target from 15km ("slowboating" to the target) leaves you incredibly vulnerable to anyone that might want to kill you. Instas make travel a lot safer.
quote:
Sean came out of the closet to say:
btw what the fuck should I be training? There were a few 'starting builds' in some Goonfleet threads, but they all pointed to skill progression with ones I don't even have the option of taking.Instant Recall, for example, is nowhere on my list, so I moved down a bit and grabbed two ranks of Iron Will and some other stuff.
This is a fantastic resource for new players -- in fact, the entire GF wiki as a whole is very informative. And if you ever have any questions, don't hesitate to ask in GF Help, or in your squadron channel. For newbie skill training, read this.
Unlike the SA forums themselves, everyone in Goonfleet is very friendly to newbies and very willing to answer questions, no matter how basic. Drysart fucked around with this message on 06-01-2006 at 05:53 PM.
quote:
Peanut butter ass Shaq Drysart booooze lime pole over bench lick:
Combat in EVE is very, very complex. There's a lot that figures in.Turrets have a maximum tracking speed (radians/sec) that they can move to follow another ship to shoot at it. They also have optimal distances -- if the target is too far away, you can't hit them. If they're too close, you can't track fast enough (closer = higher transversal velocity at lower speeds).
Missiles don't have a tracking speed, but the missiles have a maximum velocity and maximum flight time. They also have a certain explosion radius. If the explosion radius is larger than the ship it's hitting, most of the damage from the explosion goes harmlessly off into space. If the ship is travelling faster than the missile's explosion velocity away from you, not all of the force of the explosion hits the ship.
Thusly, avoiding damage from a missile boat requires completely different maneuvering than avoiding damage from a turret boat.
And this all takes place as a part of an "auto-attack" type combat function that's all computer controlled? How much direct control is given over to the player really?
I'm big on space sims, but EVE just never sounded like a space sim to me, and more like a hardcore min-maxer MMO that just happens to use the Z-axis a lot more. The screenshots look cool but every time I ask someone to describe it to me it sounds tedious. Maradon! fucked around with this message on 06-01-2006 at 07:26 PM.
quote:
Maradon! said:
And this all takes place as a part of an "auto-attack" type combat function that's all computer controlled? How much direct control is given over to the player really?I'm big on space sims, but EVE just never sounded like a space sim to me, and more like an MMO that just happens to use the Z-axis a lot more.
The damage calculations are all computer based of course, but you have control over what fires and what modules are activated on your ship. Ship and module control management is a fine line between victory and defeat.
quote:
Over the mountain, in between the ups and downs, I ran into Mortious who doth quote:
The damage calculations are all computer based of course, but you have control over what fires and what modules are activated on your ship. Ship and module control management is a fine line between victory and defeat.
So there's really not much aiming or fine flight controls involved?
quote:
Maradon! said:
So there's really not much aiming or fine flight controls involved?
You control what targets are locked, and you can fly in any direction if you want to. You have to fly differently vs different targets, as Drysart mentioned.
Ninok fucked around with this message on 06-02-2006 at 10:00 AM.
quote:
Ninok said:
I may just have to come back to eve-online to see what goonfleet is all about. Who could I contact in game to see where all the EC'ers are at?
Just give me your game name and I'll put you in the EC chat room. Some people don't go in there because they already have a bazillion chat tabs to monitor, but it's good for keeping in contact with most EC'ers and assorted friends. Mortious fucked around with this message on 06-02-2006 at 10:11 AM.
quote:
Maradon! came out of the closet to say:
So there's really not much aiming or fine flight controls involved?
You don't aim your weapons -- EVE has a very international playerbase, so the game is built to accomodate higher pings without degrading; there's no Wing Commander style twitch targetting or firing. To attack a target, you need to lock it first, which takes a different amount of time depending on the relative sizes of the two ships involved (it takes longer for a larger ship to target a smaller ship), what sort of targetting assist modules you have on your ship, and what sort of targetting deterrance modules they have on their ship. Once you're locked, your turrets will automatically track the target, and will fire when you tell them to (they do have "auto attack" that fires as fast as your weapon's rate of fire allows, but you need to be careful when you do that because you don't want to blow your loaded ammo at a suboptimal range where it'll do less damage because that might force you to take time out to reload at a time during the fight where you're getting better damage potential).
Activation of any other modules on your ship, such power drainers, capacitor boosters, webbers, scramblers, scanners, jammers -- that's at your discretion. When you turn a module on, it stays on until you turn it off, or until your ship's capacitor runs out of energy and you don't have the power to keep it on any longer.
To control maneuvering in space, there are a few "auto pilot" options you have available -- you can orbit your target at a certain distance, you can approach them to get as close as possible, you can attempt to keep them at a certain distance away -- or you can manually control your ship's direction and speed. Good pilots will manually control during fights to get the optimal flight paths needed for maximum damage/minimum exposure against an enemy. Keep in mind though, this is a ship you're piloting, you're not running a dark elf around, so you can't exactly start, stop, or turn on a dime. Different ship types move at different speeds, accelerate differently, and change course at different speeds. Battleships can take up to a minute to get up to full speed and change direction; whereas frigates only take a second or two. You may need to think your maneuvers a good 30 seconds in advance. Drysart fucked around with this message on 06-02-2006 at 10:29 AM.
quote:
Drysart said:
but you need to be careful when you do that because you don't want to blow your loaded ammo at a suboptimal range where it'll do less damage because that might force you to take time out to reload at a time during the fight where you're getting better damage potential
S'why I love lasers. No ammo.
quote:
Mortious came out of the closet to say:
S'why I love lasers. No ammo.
Yeah, but they use your cap, which in some situations is a liability.
It's great for Micro Warp Drives on frigates/inties or in many cases armor repairers or shield boosters. Also good for energy neutralizers.
quote:
Drysart said:
Yeah, but they use your cap, which in some situations is a liability.
True, that's their downfall.
I like Amarr though, I don't think I could play any other race. Lasers are my favourite weapons and I prefer to armour tank.
quote:
Mortious obviously shouldn't have said:
Just give me your game name and I'll put you in the EC chat room. Some people don't go in there because they already have a bazillion chat tabs to monitor, but it's good for keeping in contact with most EC'ers and assorted friends.
In game name is Nicroth
quote:
Mortious obviously shouldn't have said:
True, that's their downfall.I like Amarr though, I don't think I could play any other race. Lasers are my favourite weapons and I prefer to armour tank.
I've been thinking about crosstraining into Amarr ships just so I can have decent laser craft for ratting. Don't have to worry about ammo that way.
I've got other things to work on for right now, though. 16 days for HACs. 
2nd, I could never really figure out a decent combat system to use. So with that being said, what reasons do you guys have for playing?
quote:
Ninok came out of the closet to say:
Ok, the original reason why I quit was due to mining for 2 months straight day in day out. I was never really able to find a medium that liked about the game.
You can earn more mining in an hour in S-U than you could in several days in empire space; and there are several alternatives to make money with instead. The amount of time you need to spend moneymaking compared to the amount of time you can go out and blow up enemies is miniscule.
