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Author
Topic: F F X I I Discussion Thread
CBTao
Pancake
posted 11-01-2006 08:34:42 PM
Broken apart to dodge googlers.

Its been out for over 24 hours now.

Discuss. Ask. Spoiler Text.

Maradon!
posted 11-01-2006 08:53:42 PM
Worth buying a PS2 over?
Gadani
U
posted 11-01-2006 08:55:00 PM
Along with Okami and GH/2, yes.
Talonus
Loner
posted 11-01-2006 08:57:59 PM
Just for this? Probably not. There's plenty of reasons to buy a PS2 though of course.
Maradon!
posted 11-01-2006 09:06:24 PM
quote:
x--GadaniO-('-'Q) :
Along with Okami and GH/2, yes.

Okami doesn't interest me and I'll end up getting guitar hero for the 360

Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-01-2006 09:10:23 PM
Did your PS2 die on your and you simply haven't replaced it?

If you've yet to find a reason to buy a PS2, then this game will probably not be able to convince you at this point.

But for everyone else: I'm lovin' it!

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Gadani
U
posted 11-01-2006 09:14:18 PM
quote:
Nobody really understood why Maradon! wrote:
Okami doesn't interest me and I'll end up getting guitar hero for the 360

well then no

Malbi
posted 11-01-2006 09:44:16 PM
I give it a week before we even hear from anyone who played it and didn't hate it quickly...
I Didnt ask to be Secretary of Balloon Doggies, the Balloon Doggies demanded it!
Ragabash
Pancake
posted 11-01-2006 09:52:23 PM
quote:
Malbi had this to say about John Romero:
I give it a week before we even hear from anyone who played it and didn't hate it quickly...

Xplay gave it a 5 out of 5, does that count? Or do you mean from evercrest specifically?

Feed my hungry soul.
Talonus
Loner
posted 11-01-2006 09:56:09 PM
quote:
Malbi had this to say about Tron:
I give it a week before we even hear from anyone who played it and didn't hate it quickly...

Hi. I'm pretty far in the game and I've already made a post about it. I like the story, the combat system, the characters (though Vaan and Penelo really don't serve much of a point) and the voice acting. Graphics are a little weak, but the last game I played was Okami so most games will look weak in comparison. You were saying?

CBTao
Pancake
posted 11-01-2006 09:56:50 PM
I was in despair after the DQ8 Demo.

The fighting system is eh. I enjoy it, espeically with the way you can setup gambits to fight for you, the critics of the system are dead on there.

But I remember that in every ff I play, gameplay eventually devolves into me spamming X for the Fight option to blow through battles, so its really the same thing.

It looks like a FF, its story is looking to be close to Tactics in its greatness.

But it doesn't play like a FF.

Still an incredible game, it should just be called Final Fantasy Action or something, not quite deserving of the numeral.

Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-01-2006 10:12:50 PM
quote:
Your words are as empty as your soul! Mankind ill needs a savior such as CBTao!

But it doesn't play like a FF.

Still an incredible game, it should just be called Final Fantasy Action or something, not quite deserving of the numeral.


I'm going to call bullshit here. This game deserves the numeral XI. It certainly does play like an FF. The only difference between it and previous versions is that the battles are seamless with the exploration. This was simply the next logical step they could have taken in handling battles.

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Talonus
Loner
posted 11-01-2006 10:21:33 PM
quote:
Densetsu had this to say about (_|_):
I'm going to call bullshit here. This game deserves the numeral XI. It certainly does play like an FF. The only difference between it and previous versions is that the battles are seamless with the exploration. This was simply the next logical step they could have taken in handling battles.

To be fair, FFXI did a lot of things right, had a decent storyline, and had some great quests. Too bad the grinding killed it. FFXII essentially takes FFXI, retools it a little bit to correct some issues, and sticks it into a SP game.

CBTao
Pancake
posted 11-01-2006 10:36:08 PM
quote:
There was much rejoicing when Densetsu said this:
I'm going to call bullshit here. This game deserves the numeral XI. It certainly does play like an FF. The only difference between it and previous versions is that the battles are seamless with the exploration. This was simply the next logical step they could have taken in handling battles.

The next logical step from not being a proper FF, the last one that came close was X, and even then then joy of global exploration was removed.

Really, if I want to play an MMO, I'll play wow, I can solo there too.

The pinnicle of the FF series is 6, and its last gasp of breath was 9, 12 may have the writing (oh god does it ever have the writing), and the graphics, but the gameplay isn't all there, (battles, global exploration instead of zones, not having to micromanage trash loot)

That being said, I still love the shit out of it, I just don't feel its deserves a Numeral.

Nina
posted 11-01-2006 11:28:08 PM
You have to realize that repeating the same formula is bound to tire players out, and that's most likely why they started diverging from it with FFX and even more with FFXII.

And you know what? I loved FFX. I loved everything about it that was different from the previous instalments. They cut down on the annoying non-linearity some of the preceding FF games showed, to instead focus on good storytelling (altough the voice acting kinda detracts from it sometimes, I'll admit). I'd go as far as say FFX was my favorite because of that.

Still, my point is this: Just remember that what you might not like in a game, others would love. And by the brief parts we've seen in the FFXIII trailer, it's still not going back to "old style FF". Fight/Summon/Magic/Item is on its way out, better get over it.

Nina fucked around with this message on 11-01-2006 at 11:28 PM.

CBTao
Pancake
posted 11-02-2006 12:28:12 AM
Never.
Falaanla Marr
I AM HOT CHIX
posted 11-02-2006 01:56:03 AM
I think I'm the only person that is glad that global exploration went away. I never did enjoy that wander the world map shit. Made it really hard to pick up the game after not playing for a bit. If I seriously want to explore in a game, I'll play something like Oblivion.

My theory: Japanese-type RPGs are for story and interesting combat systems. Computer-type RPGs are for exploration and major character development.

Falaanla Marr fucked around with this message on 11-02-2006 at 01:58 AM.

Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-02-2006 02:35:29 AM
Global exploration didn't go away, it just went to the next step in its logical progression. Instead of exploring scaled-down regions of a world map with random encounters thrown in, you're now exploring the world, with encounters that you can see, and even avoid if you so desire. In the past, every single game Square has released that had visible, avoidable encounters has done well. I'm glad to finally see it come to Final Fantasy.


Edit: Oh, and by the way, I've always hated the entire concept of random encounters.

I may be exaggerating on every game, but there were many successes such as Chrono Trigger and Brave Fencer Musashi.

Densetsu fucked around with this message on 11-02-2006 at 02:38 AM.

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
nem-x
posted 11-02-2006 04:01:35 AM
Talonus
Loner
posted 11-02-2006 06:30:46 AM
Yeah, there's a lot of exploration in FFXII. It's just zone based instead of a big world map. The zones are quite large, many parts of the zones are optional, many zones are optional, and you can visit zones long before you actually need to go there or survive there. You could blaze through the game and skip huge parts of the world, but if you wander around there's tons tons of places to go see. Actually, I'd say there's more exploration to do in FFXII than most FF titles.
Mooj
Scorned Fanboy
posted 11-02-2006 06:47:53 AM
quote:
Densetsu had this to say about Knight Rider:
I'm going to call bullshit here. This game deserves the numeral XI. It certainly does play like an FF. The only difference between it and previous versions is that the battles are seamless with the exploration. This was simply the next logical step they could have taken in handling battles.

I absolutely agree that this game deserves to have the numeral XI. Only, it also needs a "-2" on the end of it.

The game is Final Fantasy 11, made for single players.

Skaw
posted 11-02-2006 08:06:32 AM
The games are going to lose their difining properties, you might as well not call them Final Fantasy anymore. Too many key players have left Square-Enix the last few years.
Zaeron
Pancake
posted 11-02-2006 05:43:17 PM
quote:
Skaw had this to say about dark elf butts:
The games are going to lose their difining properties, you might as well not call them Final Fantasy anymore. Too many key players have left Square-Enix the last few years.

I thought one of the defining properties of Final Fantasy was innovation. The series has brought a lot of "firsts" to the table, and I don't see why it needs to be stagnant now. I'll probably ask for this for christmas, after the disappointment of X-2 this has me hopeful.

Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-02-2006 06:03:54 PM
quote:
Die, Zaeron! You don't belong in this world!
I thought one of the defining properties of Final Fantasy was innovation. The series has brought a lot of "firsts" to the table, and I don't see why it needs to be stagnant now. I'll probably ask for this for christmas, after the disappointment of X-2 this has me hopeful.

To be fair, X-2 was the pinnacle of the Active Time Battle, and had a much better combat system than anything we had seen since 7. I still liked 8's, and I had a few problems with 9's (even though 9 is my favorite FF). I hated 10's and 11's doesn't count because it's an MMO.

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Falaanla Marr
I AM HOT CHIX
posted 11-02-2006 06:07:13 PM
quote:
Nobody really understood why Talonus wrote:
Yeah, there's a lot of exploration in FFXII. It's just zone based instead of a big world map. The zones are quite large, many parts of the zones are optional, many zones are optional, and you can visit zones long before you actually need to go there or survive there. You could blaze through the game and skip huge parts of the world, but if you wander around there's tons tons of places to go see. Actually, I'd say there's more exploration to do in FFXII than most FF titles.

Yeah, that's cool with me. What I meant by global exploration was this huge world map where you had to go find the hot spot to go to certain areas or some such. I dont so much mind it in individual zones, but the world map thing bugs me.

Mr. Gainsborough
posted 11-02-2006 07:50:41 PM
off topic, but yeah

Me and Suddar are playing Radiata Stories (Square RPG released earlier this year).

It's got a fun as shit battle system, but is horribly cliché and laughable.

Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-02-2006 08:23:43 PM
quote:
It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh! I was called here by Mr. Gainsborough who wishes to pay me tribute!
off topic, but yeah

Me and Suddar are playing Radiata Stories (Square RPG released earlier this year).

It's got a fun as shit battle system, but is horribly cliché and laughable.


Radiata Stories is a fun game (I hope to pick up another copy soon, I sold my old one because I'm poor ) but it has the absolute worst new game + ever.

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-03-2006 09:48:46 PM
I don't know about anyone else, but I've noticed that the camera during cutscenes absolutely loves to show off Fran's ass. And I'm certainly not complaining!
I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Gadani
U
posted 11-04-2006 12:44:40 PM
I like the political humor.
Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 11-05-2006 12:13:45 AM
I should hopefully be picking up a copy next weekend. I'm looking forward to it in general even with the 'bad press' I've been hearing about the gambit system. The geek part of me is interested in it and the FF player in me screams to stay away.
* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Gadani
U
posted 11-05-2006 12:39:49 AM
I love the gambit system.
Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-05-2006 03:20:59 AM
This game would be really craptastic without the Gambit system. It allows you to not have to worry about micromanaging a battle in a system where battle is faster and more streamlined. It would be nice if some of the more useful Gambits were available earlier on. Ally: Status = KO, I'm looking at you...
I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 11-05-2006 04:17:54 AM
No sense in making it a bot-fest from the start.

How are the 'extras' gained in the gambit system? Is it like gaining the extra Overdrive modes in FFX where you have to have a certain condition met X number of times (X number of turns in 'critical' to enable Daredevil, X number of killing blows to enable Victor, etc)?

* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-05-2006 04:39:16 AM
Gambits work like if>then statements. Each Gambit has two parts: a target, and an action. While actions are only limited by the actions the character can actually perform (magicks, technicks, items, etc), targets are limited by what Gambit targets you own. You get new targets as loot or by simply buying them from Gambit shops.

Target examples:
Self
Ally: any
Ally: HP < 70%
Ally: Status effect = Poison
Foe: Leader's Target
Foe: Nearest visible target
Foe: HP <= 100%
Foe: Flying

I'm sure you can come up with many combinations in your head just from these.

Gambits are also prioritized. The order in which you have them assigned determines what priority they take. For example:

Vaan has two Gambits assigned as follows:
1) [Target]Foe: Nearest Visible Target [Action]Attack
2) [Target]Ally: HP < 70% [Action]Cure

In this case, if there is an enemy within sight of Vaan, he will attack it. Also, if there is an ally in the party with less than 70% of their max HP, he will cast Cure on them. However, since the attack Gambit is above the Cure Gambit, then if there is an enemy near, AND a party member with less than 70%HP, he will attack enemies over healing his allies. Be aware that the in-game tutorial on the subject advises AGAINST Gambit setups such as this. Gambits designed to help your allies should usually take priority over ones that attack enemies. As for our example, if we reversed the priority of the Gambits, then we have ourselves a much better setup. Not the best possible, but better than it is as presented above.

I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Mr. Parcelan
posted 11-05-2006 04:54:35 AM
So, is this worth buying on story alone, gameplay alone or some combination of the two?
Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-05-2006 05:00:47 AM
Yes.
I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 11-05-2006 05:14:34 AM
Yeah, I already read a review that discussed how the gambit system worked (which is why my geek side says "yes" while the FF player says "NO!!!"), but it was unclear how you 'enabled' or 'acquired' the different gambit options. The way the article was laid out I assumed you started with a default set and then somehow 'unlocked' other options as you advanced.

How is character progression on this one? Something similar to the Sphere Grid or something more "old school" or did they go with the Job system ala FF5/Tactics?

* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Densetsu
NOT DRYSART
posted 11-05-2006 05:18:06 AM
I'm just gonna copy-paste what I just told Parce:
Ph33rDensetsu: Remember the Sphere Grid?
Parcelan: Yeah.
Ph33rDensetsu: Pretty much the only things that the License Board has in common is that you move from ability to ability, and it's a grid. Well...the sphere grid wasn't so much a grid as linear paths that you followed. The License Board is 100% non-linear.
Ph33rDensetsu: To be able to use ANYTHING in the game, you need a license for it. Be it weapons, armor, accessories, spells, augments, you name it. PRetty much the only thing that doesn't require a License are Gambits, and you still need license to unlock Gambit slots.
Ph33rDensetsu: All the licenses are on this board. You generally start with a couple of licenses in each area (a couple weapon licenses, couple armor licenses, maybe some magick)
Ph33rDensetsu: As you defeat enemies, you gain License Points (LP) that you use to purchase license panels. Purchasing a panel unlocks all adjacent panels to be purchased.
Ph33rDensetsu: So while you have to move through the various panels to get to where you want, you can go in any directions
Ph33rDensetsu: And licenses usually contain groups of abilities they allow you to use. It's not a license for Short Sword, then Long Sword, then Ancient Sword, then Zwill Blade. One license may contain Short Sword and Longsword, and another might contain Ancient Sword, Zwill Blade, Mithril Sword, stuff like that.
Ph33rDensetsu: Some of th emost powerful items in the game (Masamune, Save The Queen, Excalibure) have their own licenses though.
Ph33rDensetsu: There's more to the system, but it's getting late and I must be up fairly early
I was in the Virgin Islands once. I met a girl, we ate lobster, drank piña coladas. At sunset, we made love like sea otters. That was a pretty good day. Why couldn't I get that day over, and over?
Naimah
In a Fire
posted 11-05-2006 06:11:02 AM
I'm about 20 hours in right now and I'm loving it. Some of the boss fights are the most challenging I've had in an FF game in a long time.
Talonus
Loner
posted 11-05-2006 07:50:00 AM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Optimus Prime:
So, is this worth buying on story alone, gameplay alone or some combination of the two?

As long as you have time to play it. It's a very good game, but you're going to spend 50+ hours even if you only do minimal side quest stuff. To give an example, I'm at 70 hours right now with most of the side quest stuff that isn't going to require grinding out levels done and I have the final dungeon to go. I could easily see another 10-20 hours if I wanted to be a do everything.

I do have one major gripe though. The game needed more Cid. He's Kefka without the clown makeup and the fights against him were great.

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