Being a shrimpy, squirrely guy, I'm leaning toward something that chambers a larger round as a "compensation piece," despite my enormous genitals. However, several other factors are coming into play. This is probably going to be the only piece I invest in for a long time, so I want it to be a formidible primary self defense piece. It's also going to be a concealed carry piece, so I'd like it to be relatively small. It also has to be fairly inexpensive.
So far, I've been looking at the Taurus Millenium Pro PT145. It fits all three requirements pretty well, although it is a touch outside my price range (I most preferably want to keep it as far under $450 as possible). I also like that it's double action only, prevents ninjas from doing the thing where they slip an obstruction in front of the hammer lightning-quick.
Any other suggestions?
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Mortious attempted to be funny by writing:
It's so.. unimpressive.
Until you shoot something with it.
The .45 ACP is a pretty big round. It's also an automatic variant of the oldest round still in use today, originally made for the Colt Single Action Army in WILD WEST TIMES (!) Maradon! fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 01:48 PM.
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Maradon! wrote:
Until you shoot something with it.The .45 ACP is a pretty big round. It's also an automatic variant of the oldest round still in use today, originally made for the Colt Single Action Army in WILD WEST TIMES (!)
It still looks like a 'Lady Gun' (TM).
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Mortious had this to say about Punky Brewster:
It still looks like a 'Lady Gun' (TM).
Honestly I'd prefer a hand cannon myself, but there comes a time when function supercedes form.
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This one time, at Blindy. camp:
That thing will be a bitch for consistancy. See if you can rent one at a range before you buy it.
While that may be the case, the vast majority of shots fired in self defense are at very close range anyway.
It's not exactly a target shooting gun, no.
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Maradon! wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
While that may be the case, the vast majority of shots fired in self defense are at very close range anyway.It's not exactly a target shooting gun, no.
So you'll never use it. Check.
Go ahead and buy it.
You (probibly) won't accidentally kill the neighbors and 18 rounds is more than enough.
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Blindy. impressed everyone with:
So you'll never use it.
Hopefully.
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Y.O.T.C thought about the meaning of life:
This is my personal favorite.
Yeah, there's a reason they don't list an MSRP >_< Maradon! fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 03:03 PM.
Also dont' go by the listed MSRP. They are not an accurate measuring stick as any good gun shop will have much lower prices.
If you don't have experience with firearms, a revolver would be easier to clean and maintain.And yeah, I understand the listed MSRP will be a lot higher than the going rate, especially for a used gun. I wanted to get an idea for models to keep an eye out for that would have a nice balance of power, size, cost, and quality though. 
Kind of looks like this:
You will probably be able to find it for less than $400. The sights have three white dots on them so you can easily line up targets faster. I have been able to group shots accurately so far each time I went out shooting with this gun. I could also hit small chicken targets about 35-40 yards away fairly often.
The first shot has the longest pull of the trigger ever, and you'll wonder when it's going to fire. I guess that's good just in case you decide to not shoot someone.
But it sure is a bitch to get the last few bullets shoved into the magazine.
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We were all impressed when Norim Stumpfighter wrote:
get a used gun from a reputable dealer, that might be the way to go.
So Vinney at the gun show offering the A Desert Eagle fo $50 count as reputable?
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java the thoughts aquire speed, the teeth acquire stains, the stains become a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
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nem-x's fortune cookie read:
I could also hit small chicken targets about 35-40 yards away fairly often.
I read that as "small children targets" at first.
On to recoil... Without a doubt that PT145 will be no fun to shoot... Instead let me contrast a Sig 232 in .380 auto (losers call it 9mm Short) and a Kimber Custom Royal II in .45acp (AKA "What Bitch?")
The Important thing here is that I fire both of these on a regular basis... And other than size and velocity, the Kimber has all the advantages: 8+1 Cap, .45acp, all the awesomeness of a 1911 pistol, and as far as recoil goes... let me explain my personal view of this. When firing the Sig, the recoil is felt coming directly back. little correction is required when firing from any position (however the pistol is less accurate and has less stopping power.) I don't ever fire more than 2 mags from this pistol at any given time. Otherwise my hands begin to ache, It really is a vicious little bastard for all that. Whereas with the .45 Im good to go all day... The pistol tends to jump upwards and back, which brings your shot to shot down (If you dont practice.) but allows you to soak more of the recoil with your muscles. Magazines are also relatively inexpensive for 7 round .45's (Which is to say... not the kimbers.)
On to other toys... I think ive seen Turners Outdoors marketing "Refurbished" Glock 17's (and maybe 19's but fuck that) for around $400-500. My only advice there is dont get a "c" model... since you are thinking home defense, firing a 17c at night is as to having a dragon purge its nostrils at your face.
The big problem of course with the 1911 is it is the very definition of a large frame pistol, meaning you will have to alter your wardrobe around it.
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A sleep deprived Mortious stammered:
It's so.. unimpressive.
if you get a gun for defence, i'm pretty sure the last thing you'd care about is how it looks. personally, i'd rather have one of those wallet sized "girly guns" then a desert eagle if I was still in hartford and needed one to defend myself.
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diadem had this to say about Captain Planet:
if you get a gun for defence, i'm pretty sure the last thing you'd care about is how it looks. personally, i'd rather have one of those wallet sized "girly guns" then a desert eagle if I was still in hartford and needed one to defend myself.
I dunno, if you're packin a deagle, you might not even have to fire it 
EDIT: Fucking enter key. Real post inc. Arttemis fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 07:40 PM.
If you're really concerned with power while still making it easy to handle, may I suggest a S&W .38 snub-nose? It'll do plenty of damage, and it's just as accurate as the Millenium.
And I'm pretty sure it's cheaper.
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Nobody really understood why Idspispopd wrote:
Point being, I was in the Army, and issued a Desert Eagle.
No, you weren't. Get the fuck out. The last thing Maradon needs is a Chairborne Ranger giving him advice.
Just my two cents, Mara, but I'd stay away from the Steyr. I've got one, and the best I can say for it is that it's an interesting little gimmick piece. I've been trying to get rid of it for a while now.
I'd pass on the G36, as well. A 6 round magazine capacity isn't very attractive in a carry pistol. A 1911 would suit you better, or, my personal choice, a Glock 30. I wouldn't recommend it if your hands are on the smaller side, as it's got a bit more girth than a 1911, but it does have a higher magazine capacity.
Be sure to be mindful of how you're going to be carrying when you select your piece, as well. I can get away with carrying a beefier pistol because of the cold climate here. I can wear a pretty heavy denim overshirt, and carry on the hip with no problem. If you live in a balmier climate, you won't have that same luxury.
EDIT: Yes, Kael, they do. Arttemis fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 08:04 PM.
I'd either go for a dinky .25 caliber tiny pistol or an Mk23 for sweetness factor.
haha, chairborne ranger Fazum'Zen Fastfist fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 08:11 PM.
"Don't want to sound like a fanboy, but I am with you. I'll buy it for sure, it's just a matter of for how long I will be playing it..."
- Silvast, Battle.net forums
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Check out the big brain on Fazum'Zen Fastfist!
Mk23 for sweetness factor.
$$$$ 
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haha, chairborne ranger
I got a kick out of that, too. Sean fucked around with this message on 01-10-2005 at 08:17 PM.
It's not something people hear about.
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There was much rejoicing when Fazum'Zen Fastfist said this:
So you want it for self-defense but you're looking at a .45 caliber pistol? It could look bad in court if you annihilate someone's body part and say it was in self-defense.I'd either go for a dinky .25 caliber tiny pistol or an Mk23 for sweetness factor.
haha, chairborne ranger
uh, a .45 is the optimal home defense handgun imo, its a bullet big enough to knock a full sized man down without overpenetrating your house on any misses or non-bone shots.
a .44 mag, .50, 454, S&W 500 would be the limb removal guns
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We were all impressed when CBTao wrote:
...44 mag...limb removal guns
You are sooooo tempting me to quote Dirty Harry
So...Maradon...you know they're going to kick you out of the necro guild for trading in your Duckstick for a real weapon, right?
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
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Fazum'Zen Fastfist's fortune cookie read:
So you want it for self-defense but you're looking at a .45 caliber pistol? It could look bad in court if you annihilate someone's body part and say it was in self-defense.I'd either go for a dinky .25 caliber tiny pistol or an Mk23 for sweetness factor.
haha, chairborne ranger
The idea that your choice of Caliber has any impact on any court case you may have to be involved in, is nothing more than an urban legend. If you are going to rely on something like a .25 or .22 for self defense then you may as well not bother. Oh sure it MAY kill the person. But they are not going to die for hours unless you place the round perfectly. I have seen images of a woman who unleaded a .25 caliber handgun into her rapist. 6 or 7 rounds hit him in the chest and abdomen afterwards he beat her so bad that her jaw was no longer attached to her skull. I consider anything less than .380 inadequate for self defense.
Let me explain. There are generally three types of criminals you will find yourself in a position to need to defend yourself from. .
1: Opportunistic scum:
These are the guys that see you and your girl walking and think you look like a good target. They will approach, act like they have a weapon, and demand money, jewelry, etc. They generally cowards and brandishing a firearm will scare them away. I have had run ins with this type of person. Scary but not as dangerous as the others I am listing.
2: Calculating criminal:
These are generally your home invaders, they will break in your place in the middle of the night and get as much as they can. THey range from the cat burglar to some groups who will dress like police and bust down your door. Rule of thumb is that they are on your property and are a threat to you or your family. To me this makes them targets. These are moderately more dangerous because they may be armed and are not generally alone.
3: Drugged up/Drunk/Crazy people:
By far the most dangerous type of criminal you will run into. They do not care about themselves, they do not care about you, and in general they don't care about that gun you are pointing at them. Drugs and or Alcohol can push a person to the point that they do not know they should die when they are shot. the most extreme record I have heard of this was a man on PCPs that was shot over 30 times by .40 caliber police handguns. He still managed to get to one of the officers and attack him. In this care you want as much stopping power as possible. And you want the skill to use the gun properly. No matter how drugged you are, if you have no head you can not fight.
Owning a firearm is a huge responsibility and is not for everyone. You must not only know how to use a firearm, but also when and if you can use it. now but if I don't mean just if you are legally able to but also if you, as a person, are able to pull the trigger and take another persons life. For all my firearm knowledge and skill that is a question I had to think long and hard about before I started carrying a weapon. Taking another human life is not easy and it never should be.
Now another thing. Dont' fall into the whole "I will just shoot him in the leg" Bullshit. Because it is just that, Bullshit. If you ever have reason to pull a firearms you will be scared, you will be shaking, and you will be acting on autopilot. You don't have time to think, you don't have time to take aim at the leg. You aim at center mass and you pull the trigger. If you ever do pull a firearm you had better intend to use it and you had better be shooting to kill. Otherwise you have no business having it, you are a danger to others and yourself.
PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE. And don't just go to the range and shoot, make sure the weapon is un -loaded and practice drawing and taking aim. Your goal here is muscle memory. When you are in a bad situation you want instinct to take over. Also make sure you can operate the gun in not so perfect situations. Practice changing magazines and clearing jams. (doesn't apply to a revolver) If you have an automatic always have a spare mag with it. While you probably wont' need the ammo you may need it for clearing a stovepipe or other failure to feed.
Now I could type all night but I need to get to Cathy's before she shoots me. I leave you with the 4 rules. These are Dogma for any firearms owner.
1: All guns are always loaded! (I do'n' care if you have checked the gun 6 times. Check it again before dry firing or cleaning)
2: Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy!
3: Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target!
4: Always be sure of your target! (And what is behind it)
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Arttemis probably says this to all the girls:
Just my two cents, Mara, but I'd stay away from the Steyr. I've got one, and the best I can say for it is that it's an interesting little gimmick piece. I've been trying to get rid of it for a while now.
What dont' you like about your Steyr? Mine has been a great shooter since the day I got it. Points better than any other pistol I have. Accurate and reliable. DId I just get lucky? If you are wanting to sell yours I may be interested in another.
