I imagine it's a lot like being Delidgamond, but not as bad.

That's not even funny. Not in the least. Even if you were remotely serious, I wouldn't explain it to you. You couldn't even possibly grasp the concept.

And for the record. I hold citizenship both in Israel and the United States.

Well, except the Delidgamond bit of course! It's probably the only thing worse than being Delidgamond.

And don't let my childish antics fool you. I'm not as dumb as I make myself out to be for a cheap laugh around here. (Glad I didn't say that in the Flameball Forum. ohnose)

[ 06-23-2003: Message edited by: Comrade Snoota ]

But I still don't know the difference between Isralites and Palistinians.

I know they don't like each other, and I know one throws rocks at the other, but that's about it.

Am I a bad person?

Flameball Forum?

quote:

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The logic train ran off the tracks when Mr. Crabs said:

Flameball Forum?

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Well, there are two ways to take this; that you're confused as to what the "Flameball Forum" is, but since you've posted there before and you made that post before I edited mine, it is safe to assume you weren't asking why it wasn't in the Flameball Forum.

Which just doesn't make SENSE.

edit: I missed two letters of the upmost importance.

[ 06-23-2003: Message edited by: Comrade Snoota ]

Then what's this one?

quote:

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A sleep deprived Fazum'Zen Fastfist stammered:
Wait, what did I miss, folks?

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The plane-dropped pamphlets explain it all.

quote:

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Sean wrote this stupid crap:
Oh, alright then.

Then what's this one?

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This is the one where you fucking retards shut the fuck up trying to ruin the thread and Old Hickory schools us in the real world most of us will never experience.

Old Hickory, if you want this thread locked again, just say the word. If you people can actually have a decent conversation, I'll not only be surprised, but I'll applaud as well.

[ 06-23-2003: Message edited by: LOG ]

quote:

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Delphi Aegis was naked while typing this:
It's been years. And numerous people have tried to explain it to me.

But I still don't know the difference between Isralites and Palistinians.

I know they don't like each other, and I know one throws rocks at the other, but that's about it.

Am I a bad person?

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No, just uninformed.

The first thing you need to know is that the Jewish (Israel) and Islam (Palistine) faiths both have the same origins. Both hold that part of the world as sacred.

Part of the fallout of WWII was the creation of Israel within the Palistinian region. I'm not up on all the details (I've heard too many conflicting versions of the story) of how fair this was, but it was done.

From that day, both sides have fought over that land, and their own defence. Radicals on both sides feel that it is their God given mission to control the "Holy Land", whatever it takes. With these people around to keep stirring things up, it's doubtful that there will ever be peace in that part of the world till one group or the other is totally destroyed.

quote:

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We all got dumber when Palador ChibiDragon said:
Part of the fallout of WWII was the creation of Israel within the Palistinian region. I'm not up on all the details (I've heard too many conflicting versions of the story) of how fair this was, but it was done.

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It wasn't fair. Although the Isreal border lines were drawn up with all accounts of legality taken into consideration, the fact remains that the indiginous people were moved rather unceremoniously from their homes, but this is not where the real problem began. When the lines were drawn, not much attention was paid to the location of Palistinian settlements. there are numerous places where the national boarder runs directly though a settlement. The Palistinians lucky enough to live on the israeli side get to be second class citizens, which might suck, but they also get to live in a nation with lots of first-world technology and backing, in a region surrounded by third-world countrys.

Jackass conservitives and idiotic liberals will pipe to you that the Palistinians are either simply jelous of the advances in Isreal, or that they are simply fighting to defend their rightful homeland. The truth lies somewhere in between.

Palistine did not exhist as a country or orginization before Israel moved in. They do not have a legal claim on the Holy lands, other than the fact that they actually lived there, at least not a claim recognized by any of the nations that matter.

Israel did, does, and will continue to abuse palistinians that are both Israelli second-rate-citizens, and those who live directly outside their boarders.

Isreal did, does, and will continue to try to force peace by simply grabbing the rest of any and all settlements that form on it's boarders (the main cause of unrest)

Isreal did, does, and will continue to act in a very heavy handed and sloppy manner when responding to terrorist attacks. The last thing any country should do is hold as example an attack that kills 20 children in response to an attack that injures 5. However, it is argueable that the very counter-attacks that are reported as brutality on the news are made that way by both the Arabic tendancy to hide guilty members in places where attacking them causes unneccisary civilian casualties, as well as a tendancy of the Palistian government to report 30 deaths where only 4 bodies lay.

Palistine did, does, and will continue to distort facts and hide it's support of some blatent terrorist activities. I for one belive this will never be fully ruited until a seemingly impossible ammicable agreement can be reached between Israel and the psudeo nation.

Palistine did, does, and will continue to completely ignore requests from the Israeli goverment to divert settlers away from the boarders. Palistinians flock there to try for a better life in the shadow of a first-world population.

Palistinian populations are not under the control of the palistinian government. They do what they please, move where they please and seem to either want to join Israel for a better life or blow it up for a religious reason.

There are many, many, many facits to the conflict. No one man could possibly know everything, even if they have lived in the area and witnessed it first hand. And no one post on a forum could even hope to cover a portion of the problems that the region faces.

The land was Canaan. The Hebrews took the land of Canaan, and from it Israel was created. Israel split in two. The Kingdoms of Judea and Israel. Israel fell to the Assyrians. Years later Judea fell to Babylon.

Babylon started the exile of the Hebrews from Israel. Babylon fell to Persia. Persians allowed to exiles to return to the Holy Land and rebuild. There were Jews left in the area during the exile.

The Persians fell to Alexander the Great. He died. His empire was split up amongst his generals. The area was contested between Egyptian and Syrian Macedonian factions. Syria won in the end. After sometime the Hebrews rebelled against the Syrians and won independence. A new independent Hebrew kingdom existed.

Enter the Romans. The land was held by them for centuries. The Jews revolted. A 2nd exile. Then the Byzantine Empire. It was conquered by the Islamic wave in the 7th centry AD. There it was held by various Islamic kingdoms until the Crusades. For 99 years it was under Christian rule. Then the Muslims retook the holy land. Again, there was a thriving Hebrew culture in the area, though dimly.

Forward to the Ottoman Turks. They ruled the area until World War I. For the most part they were tolerant of the Jews. More than the Christians of the period. After Word War I, the British took control of "Palestine." Back track to the 1800's. The Zionist movement. Jews had been returning to the Holy Land. The goal was to re-establish a homeland for the Jews. The British supported this. In a British document they even stated that "Palestine" would be that home. The Jews had cultural and historical claims to the land. Keep in mind. Palestine is not just Israel and the West Bank. It is also what is now Jordan.

After World War I the Brits made promises to certain Arab leaders who rebelled against the Turks in the war. They created the artificial countries of Trans-Jordan and Iraq. They gave them these countries. After it was promised to the Jews.

They forbade the Jews from going into what became Trans-Jordan. Strictly for the Arabs. We know what happened after WW II. There was a streaming of Jews into the Holy Land. The Brits tried to restrict this from happening. The Arabs were allowed free access into the land. Land that was supposed to go for a Jewish Homeland. After they already took 85 percent of Palestine for the creation of Trans-Jordan. Didn't work. Things got nasty.

The UN took over the mandate held by the old League of Nations. It called for the creation of a Jewish nation and an Arab nation. Didn't happen. The Jews proclaimed the State of Israel in 1948. The Arabs our right refused. It was all or nothing. They attacked Israel. They thought it would be quick work. Didn't turn out that way. Oh..historical fact here. The Israelis did not create the refugee problem. They didn't remove the arabs from the land. They were told to leave by Arabs. Not to get in the way of the Arab armies that would push the Jews to the sea. The majority of the Arabs left due to this call. Again, didn't turn out the way they thought.

Again. Interesting historical point. During this time "Palestinian" actually was the term used for the jews. The Arabs made it clear there was no actual Palestine. It was part of Southern Syria. After the war, the areas that were to be made part of the Arab homeland as stated by the UN, were annexed by Syria, Trans-Jordan, and Egypt. Not Israel. Up until the 6 day war in the 60's. These lands were controlled by Arab nations. They could have created a nation of Palestine at anytime. They didn't. The countries that did control the areas kept these people as refugees. They didn't take them in or provide a home. Trans-Jordan now had the West Bank. They dropped the Trans and just became Jordan, as they now controlled both sides of the Jordan. Several years later they were the only country to offer citizenship to "Palestinians." The King of Jordan felt they were one people. They are one people actually.

The PLO was created in 1964. There goal was for the absolute destruction of Israel. Now, let's get to the PLO being about liberating the occupied West Bank. The bank wasn't taken by Israel until 1967, in the six day war. The organization that claims to be about liberating the West Bank was created nearly 4 years before Israel took the West Bank. Again, from 1948..to 1967..the Arab nations controlled the area that was to be the Arab homeland in the region. Not Israel. The arabs rejected creation of a homeland. They wanted all of the land. This is why there is no ntion of Palestine today. Not because the Jews took the land and forced them out.

After the Six day war, Israel took the West Bank, and GazaStrip, and the Golan Heights. They also returned the Sinai and the Golan Heigths. Israel, the nation that was attacked, not the attacker in any war, returned the land it took. Except the West Bank.

Now the refugee question. Israel did indeed allow several families back into the country. Of course they were tough in doing so. Hello...these were people determined for the total destruction of the nation. And several people weren't allowed to return. Oh..another funny thing. The United States and Israel contributed more money to aid the refugees than the entire Middle East. Israel did stop in the late 70's. The US still is the biggest donor to humanitarian aid.

Another tidbit about evil Israelis. After the Six Day War. The arabs were packing to leave. The Israeli General convinced them to stay. To make peace. We asked them to stay. Even back to '48, the Jews wanted to co-exist with the Arabs.

[ 06-24-2003: Message edited by: OldHickory ]

I know, It's bad

[ 06-24-2003: Message edited by: OldHickory ]

quote:

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LOG's unholy Backstreet Boys obsession manifested in:
Thread reopened for a chance at civility.

Old Hickory, if you want this thread locked again, just say the word. If you people can actually have a decent conversation, I'll not only be surprised, but I'll applaud as well.

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HOly shit its log...