quote:
Jens got all f'ed up on Angel Dust and wrote:
yeah pretty muchi guess it's pretty tough being you :/
Are you trying to be a dick?
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
quote:
A sleep deprived Jens stammered:
No really, if you think something is stupid or unfounded, you can either ignore it or debunk it and yes, it is, in my opinion, up to you to do so.
That defies logic.
Literally.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
quote:
Bloodsage came out of the closet to say:
why do you think it's legitimate to post something either entirely without basis or pure propaganda. . .yet it's supposed to be given the same treatment as if it were intelligent political commentary.
And here's the problem. You don't like the content of what was posted, so previously you'd have simply treated it as bullshit and responded with flames. Just because you don't agree with something doesn't mean it's propaganda.
These two threads are good examples of opposites:
The wire thread is pure speculation, and easily exposed as such. As far as I'm concerned, the burden of proof to a statement lies on the person making the statement. There's not a burden to disprove it placed on everyone else -- as anyone with an ounce of critical thinking skills will see right through it to see that it's based on nothing substantial. Discuss how there's no substance behind the speculation, and therefore it means next to nothing.
The Bush record thread, on the other hand, is a combination of crap points; questionable points; and real, serious points. See, just because someone has three points and one of them is shaky, it doesn't automatically make the other two points into propaganda. In fact, I personally severely look down on anyone who dismisses something as propaganda, because that's just a wholesale ignoral without consideration. Point out the crap points as crap; and ask for sources (because you never know, they might not be crap) -- but certainly do not attack the person.
The key distinction I'm trying to make here is that I don't want political arguments. I want political discussion, which includes giving respect to the other point of view. If you don't want to have political discussion, you are hereby invited not to participate in political threads. Drysart fucked around with this message on 10-09-2004 at 12:36 PM.
Why not require a person making a thread to have a point, and to argue it? That seems only fair. A random cut-and-paste with nothing added is worthless.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
quote:
Bloodsage came out of the closet to say:
Got it: no problem posting obvious bullshit, since it's everyone else's job to disprove it, and to wade through accompanying crap in search of the one or twe valid points.
It's not everyone else's job to disprove it, as I clearly stated above. Certainly they can point out that it's thin and ask for more detail. If someone posts obvious bullshit, they run the risk of everyone seeing it as such. Discussions are not shouting matches to see who gets the last word, after all. Credibility in a discussion comes from making informed posts, not bullshit posts.
quote:
Bloodsage came out of the closet to say:
Why not require a person making a thread to have a point, and to argue it? That seems only fair. A random cut-and-paste with nothing added is worthless.
Because it's not an argument. If I want to post something that I'm unsure about, so therefore have no viewpoint on yet, to generate discussion over it, that's perfectly acceptable. In all of human history, nobody has ever changed anyone else's mind on a political matter in an internet message board post; so that's not the goal of politics threads. The goal is for everyone to give their input, and why. If they don't have input, well, there may very well be reasons for that too. In any case, the reasoned discussion is far more useful to an undecided than four pages of "OMG YOU SMELL LIBERAL" and "WTF NO BLOOD FOR OIL" repeated incessantly. Drysart fucked around with this message on 10-09-2004 at 01:07 PM.
Nice addition to the rules, btw.(I needed an excuse to use that emoticon ok I think it's cute as hell Addy fucked around with this message on 10-09-2004 at 01:14 PM.
)
I like the new addition.
And I think we're using the word "argument" in different ways, but that's a different discussion. 
I also agree that it's perfectly acceptable to post something in an effort to learn more about it. Posting something cut-and-pasted from somewhere else with no comment at all (even, "I'm not sure what to make of this"), however, seems to me a cop-out and the next best thing to trolling, since the only purpose of the post becomes to elicit reactions from others and enjoy the show.
Your call, though. It's easy enough simply to point out which rabid conspiracies don't hold water.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
quote:
Bloodsage obviously shouldn't have said:
It's easy enough simply to point out which rabid conspiracies don't hold water.
1) a photo of something suspicious.
2) an invite for people to try to figure out what was going on in it.
Which is quite different. And saying you can't post something politically related with out having a point to debate against is the dumbest thing i've ever heard. That would mean people can't post political jokes, funny political pictures, links to jib jab vidoes, ect.
Quit bitching.
quote:
Blindy came out of the closet to say:
Except I didn't post a rabid conspiracy.
This is not the venue to complain.
quote:
Drysart attempted to be funny by writing:
This is not the venue to complain.
I move for a change of venue, your honor!
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
quote:
Ja'Deth Issar Ka'bael had this to say about John Romero:
I move for a change of venue, your honor!
I object! The motion was not supported by a bag of doritos, your Honor.
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
quote:
Ja'Deth Issar Ka'bael had this to say about Punky Brewster:
You fool! A bag of Doritos can't support anything! It's floppy, like ogre wang!
Objection, Your Honor! The Defense is stating a matter of opinion! The Prosecution can provide several examples where ogre wang can be quite stiff.
