You only get more enemies, which isn't that great of a bonus. The ranger class is good for first level because of the automatic Ambidexterity and Two Weapon fighting, but other than that, why stay with a ranger?
I saw a good remake of the ranger on Monte Cook's web site ( http://www.montecook.com ) and wonder what everyone else's opinons are of his changes.
quote:
Kegwen Tabibito had this to say about Cuba:
D&D3e rangers pwn. n00b.
You become far more powerful multiclassing from ranger to fighter or barbarian after level 1 than if you remain ranger.
More skills maybe, but a fighter gets far more feats, and the barbarian's special abilities far outweigh those skills too.
Give me a real reason not to multiclass after level 1
STAYING IN CHARACTER.
Maybe my character's purpose in life is something besides becoming TRE UBER!!!
Besides that... Spells. :P [ 02-23-2002: Message edited by: Kegwen Tabibito ]
quote:
Kegwen Tabibito wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
Easy:STAYING IN CHARACTER.
Maybe my character's purpose in life is something besides become TRE UBER!!!
But... besides that...
You're level 1, just made 1000 exp, you don't have a "character" defined yet but are just begining your journey. Why follow the path of the whimp if you know you will be going up against more and more powerful foes that you need to defeat or die?
Surviving is in character for anyone. 
...Somebody flame him for me. [ 02-23-2002: Message edited by: Kegwen Tabibito ]
I'll hold my final judgement until I read Masters of the Wild, though.
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Duck Tales:
I actually kind of agree with them. That just ain't what a ranger is supposed to be.I'll hold my final judgement until I read Masters of the Wild, though.
I have Masters of the Wild already. Some okay new feats, okay new spells, okay PrCs for the Ranger (GREAT PrCs for Barbarians!) but still the Ranger isn't what the ranger should be.
Monte Cook's ranger is far better, but you drop from d10 to d8 HD. You seen his update Parce?
There really isn't much point to being a ranger in 3rd, beyond 1st level. Technically, anyways.
Paladins are sort-of the same way.
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Elethi had this to say about Pirotess:
I also agree.There really isn't much point to being a ranger in 3rd, beyond 1st level. Technically, anyways.
Paladins are sort-of the same way.
Paladins get turning, Paladins get better mounts, Paladin spells are worthwhile. The kind of player who plays a Paladin (well) will stick with the class most likely. No reason to be a Paladin at first level if you aren't staying for the long haul anyway. 
quote:
Zephyer wrote, obviously thinking too hard:
I happen to be quite fond of skills.
Make shure your first level is as a rouge then.
It appears he simply integrated the fighter/wizard concept of bonus feats into the existing ranger class. Not really much of a balanced improvement. If you want to give extra talents to the ranger, try augmenting them with class-based talents. For example, allow them to add a strength bonus to bows without the use of a mighty composite bow. Give them improved critical, or increased chance of critical, when using a ranged weapon. Give them special survival skills. But just saying, "Take some bonus feats," will only water down the ranger class to look like a souped-up fighter (cue Drizzt).
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Kanid thought this was the Ricky Martin Fan Club Forum and wrote:
You're level 1, just made 1000 exp, you don't have a "character" defined yet but are just begining your journey. Why follow the path of the whimp if you know you will be going up against more and more powerful foes that you need to defeat or die?Surviving is in character for anyone.
For a true roleplayer, the character is set before you even begin. You follow the path of the "wimp" if that's the sort of personality you set yourself up for. Someone who's been training to be a ranger all their life in their background isn't just going to call it quits one day and become a fighter, etc. If you play with the sort of people that are like that, then you must never do anything more than hack and slash dungeon crawls :P
Besides, a good DM always finds a way to make everyone's best points come through. If you go against tougher foes, then the stronger ones can hit it, and the weaker ones will have to get sneaky. So in a good party with a good DM, being a "wimp" isn't going to get you killed. [ 02-23-2002: Message edited by: Lyinar ]
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
Err... right click, save targest as.... [ 02-23-2002: Message edited by: Lalamile ]
That way should work....
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
first, ranger Elf are the best *sigh*
(stupid damm elf)
ya can turn it Archer ... & bow can they use a bow
they can turn more Druid, whit a few pet Dire animal friends *shivers*
Ooooor ya can make them Rogue like.
personaly, i think that Rangers, if you place your skill & feet right, can be a pain the ass, yes, they wont feel as superior as any othere class, but... they Can do about everything =)
Companions, which can get deadly as time goes by.
Spells, etc.
They are balanced, what you suggest tends towards making them superior. While crossing paths with a Ranger/Fighter is more powerful than just crossing paths with a Ranger. Its no different than any other class not multiclassed.
And Rangers have always been, in my opinion anyways, the shadow stalkers. Hunters in the silence.
And above all, it is personal preference and RP. And yes you SHOULD have an idea who you are, or who you are going to be before you start. If you are a Ranger, then well you may just wanna stay true to being a Ranger.
* Now Playing: Metallica - Anywhere I Roam.
* Now Playing: Twisted Sister - The Beast
Now I'm more of a rogue type, with an occasional tendancy for cleric.
I never understood the desire to be a ranger, and with the abilities they have, there is really no driving force to be a ranger, I could do the same thing with a pure fighter after 1 level of ranger.
Monte Cook's ranger does not JUST add bonus feats, but the bonus feats must be from the list of special feats he created, specificially for the ranger. These feats actually make the Favored Enemy a worthwhile thing.
The way a ranger gets bonus feats, two at level 1 and then no more, lends itself to some abuse as a low-level class.
First, when wearing light armour, rangers get ambidexterity and two weapon fighting absolutely free. That means that from level 1, you can dual weild, AND you have room for other feats. Just in case you didn't know, Studded Leather and Chain Shirt are light armours.
Second, in 2e they got Stealth. Not entirely sure about 3e, though, lemmee check...
Third, spells. They get SPELLS! Something that a fighter CAN NOT GET. AT ALL. NO, NEVER, NOT EVER. NOT EVEN AT LEVEL 129.
Fourth, if you want to sacrifice ambidex and two-weapon fighting, you can wear medium armour (You don't HAVE TO wear light) or, spend a feat and get Heavy Armour Proficiency, and put on nice shiny full plate. Same AC as a fighter.
Fifth, it's the RP thing. Rangers are supposed to use bows more. That's why they're called rangers. They fight at a range, and only get into melee when, or should I say IF, the enemy gets close enough. You want a pure melee? Play a fighter. This is not EQ, it's D&D. The two games are VERY, VERY different.
That's all.
