My hat is off to China, but I hold nothing but utter contempt to the legislative bastards who banned it here. Oh well, for advanced medicine, we'll all be looking to China.
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It is also claimed the secret technique leaves participants looking and feeling years younger.
The secret is Calgon.
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So quoth Maradon!:
Don't look at me, it's shit like this that got me to vote libertarian.
Fear not, for when we die we'll all go to heaven for abstaining from the sin of stem cell research--it says so explicitly in the good book!
The Chinese on the other hand, won't die.
[Edit: Not that I'm one prone to hyperbole, anyway.] Pvednes fucked around with this message on 06-20-2005 at 12:23 PM.
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Pvednes had time to sputter this out before being killed by someone else's ambush:
The Chinese on the other hand, won't die.
Suddenly I imagine the next big kung fu movie being about a lowly peasant who travels far and wide to discover the secret of the ancient monks' techniques...and it's stem cell research.
Disclaimer: I'm just kidding, I love all living things.
The fastest draw in the Crest.
"The Internet is MY critical thinking course." -Maradon
"Gambling for the husband, an abortion for the wife and fireworks for the kids they chose to keep? Fuck you, Disneyland. The Pine Ridge Indian Reservation is the happiest place on Earth." -JooJooFlop
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Pvednes had this to say about Cuba:
Fear not, for when we die we'll all go to heaven for abstaining from the sin of stem cell research--it says so explicitly in the good book!The Chinese on the other hand, won't die.
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Pvednes had this to say about Robocop:
Fear not, for when we die we'll all go to heaven for abstaining from the sin of stem cell research--it says so explicitly in the good book!
That'd be the Book of Dubya and Johnny? I wouldnt worry about it. Neither of them will be in power much longer (Dubya after '08, and Johnny com the next election), and there are NUMEROUS examples of laws being overturned or re-written by a new government that comes to power.
The only unfortunate thing is that the vast majority of complaint/protest against stem-cell research has been based on the whole "OMG IT COMES FROM DEAD BABIES!!" emotional aspect, as opposed to any logical and coherent opposition. For instance (and AFAIK, not being a scientist type), Stem cells can also be obtained from the placenta and birth cord of healthy born babies, not to mention the thousands of frozen embryos set aside for artificial insemination that are never actually used (and often disposed of without being used).
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Tarquinn wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
theehe.
Yes, I spit out bits of croissant at that one.
Kudos to the witmaster Pvednes.
Anyway, about the article.
It's both interesting and depressing that the reason this rich guy is donating so much money to stem cell research is so he can use the benefits on himself.
He's already pretty old and sickly-looking, it seems unrealistic for him to expect a breakthrough in his lifetime. then again, maybe he's just desperate. *shrug*
It seems like the longer we extend our lives, the more we fear the inevitable end. In ancient and not-so-ancient times, especially among the poor classes, death was just an accepted way of life. Of course the security of the "opium of the masses" helped keep that blase feeling of "come what may" going, but even still, there is a great amount of religion today and yet you still run into people all the time who are terrified about death.
I don't understand what propagates this fear. Is it just that the more we know, the more we realize how much we don't know? That sounds corny, but it's the only reason I can come up with on my own. Kait fucked around with this message on 06-20-2005 at 05:19 PM.
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Kait had this to say about Tron:
.It's both interesting and depressing that the reason this rich guy is donating so much money to stem cell research is so he can use the benefits on himself.
He's already pretty old and sickly-looking, it seems unrealistic for him to expect a breakthrough in his lifetime. then again, maybe he's just desperate. *shrug*
I don't think it is unrealistic at all. Scientists have known for a long time that this would be a potential result of such tests. They've just never had the time/money/authorization to do it.
Wait...it's depressing that he is spending his own money how he see's fit? Gimmie a break. This is the second thread in which you have expressed distaste for people spending their own money in a way you don't agree with.
Of course he wants to use it on himself, but if this turns out to be the real deal, his money will have gone towards helping many others. Does that make it any less "depressing" for you?
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Reynar got all f'ed up on Angel Dust and wrote:
Wait...it's depressing that he is spending his own money how he see's fit? Gimmie a break. This is the second thread in which you have expressed distaste for people spending their own money in a way you don't agree with.
iirc we cleared up that she didn't mean that.
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And I was all like 'Oh yeah?' and Noxhil2 was all like:
To be honest, this kind of sounds like a load of crap. A secret method for making people feel younger? It has all the markings of a scam.
Why? We've already seen cases where doctors used Cord Blood to make someone walk again. And Cord Blood isn't nearly as effective as embryo stem cells have the potential to be.
It's not unrealistic to observe someone's eyesight improve, or sexual vigor to be increased from such a treatment. I think this is just the beginning.
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Peanut butter ass Shaq Kait booooze lime pole over bench lick:
It seems like the longer we extend our lives, the more we fear the inevitable end. In ancient and not-so-ancient times, especially among the poor classes, death was just an accepted way of life. Of course the security of the "opium of the masses" helped keep that blase feeling of "come what may" going, but even still, there is a great amount of religion today and yet you still run into people all the time who are terrified about death.I don't understand what propagates this fear. Is it just that the more we know, the more we realize how much we don't know? That sounds corny, but it's the only reason I can come up with on my own.
Your assertation of "The Past VS The Present" is based entirely on hollywood depictions of the past. Your concept of the current prevailing attitude toward mortality is also incorrect.
People have always been positively horrified by their own mortality. Fear of death is one of the biggest reasons religion was concieved in the first place. The egyptians were so afraid of dying they built gigantic ceremonial pyramids to appease the gods and brought live slaves with them into their tombs to accompany them into the afterlife. Fear of death is one of the primary motivating forces of early man.
In contrast, fast foward to a couple years ago when a poll was conducted asking people what their greatest fear was. Number one was public speaking, number two was death.
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Maradon! had this to say about pies:
Your assertation of "The Past VS The Present" is based entirely on hollywood depictions of the past. Your concept of the current prevailing attitude toward mortality is also incorrect.People have always been positively horrified by their own mortality. Fear of death is one of the biggest reasons religion was concieved in the first place. The egyptians were so afraid of dying they built gigantic ceremonial pyramids to appease the gods and brought live slaves with them into their tombs to accompany them into the afterlife. Fear of death is one of the primary motivating forces of early man.
In contrast, fast foward to a couple years ago when a poll was conducted asking people what their greatest fear was. Number one was public speaking, number two was death.
Nice try. No. I've done extensive research on medieval times, it's one of my passions.
And, again, I emphasize that I'm talking mostly about the poorer classes. The pyramids weren't contrived by the peasants who built them--they were ordered by the fucktard pharaohs themselves because well-paid priests told them they would be forgotten if they did not make a monument to themselves, and that what they had on them in life would be what went through to the next life.
And in regard to that poll, I bet if you'd asked the people something more along the lines of "What do you fear more: public speaking or death?" how many people do you think would have said public speaking, and meant it? Kait fucked around with this message on 06-20-2005 at 06:49 PM.
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Kait had this to say about Duck Tales:
Nice try. No. I've done extensive research on medieval times, it's one of my passions.And, again, I emphasize that I'm talking mostly about the poorer classes. The pyramids weren't contrived by the peasants who built them--they were ordered by the fucktard pharaohs themselves because well-paid priests told them they would be forgotten if they did not make a monument to themselves, and that what they had on them in life would be what went through to the next life.
And in regard to that poll, I bet if you'd asked the people something more along the lines of "What do you fear more: public speaking or death?" how many people do you think would have said public speaking, and meant it?
Educate me then, when did ancient Egypt become a medieval society?
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Verily, Sakkra doth proclaim:
Educate me then, when did ancient Egypt become a medieval society?
It didn't, I only talked about Egypt because Maradon! brought it up and I didn't want to leave him confused about what I was specifically talking about.
If you really want to get knee-deep in Medieval sentiments, ask me about it when I get home and have time to dig up all my old medieval textbooks and what not *cracks knuckles and smiles*
Although they're all in boxes with all my other books right now 
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Kait had this to say about Pirotess:
Nice try. No. I've done extensive research on medieval times, it's one of my passions.And, again, I emphasize that I'm talking mostly about the poorer classes. The pyramids weren't contrived by the peasants who built them--they were ordered by the fucktard pharaohs themselves because well-paid priests told them they would be forgotten if they did not make a monument to themselves, and that what they had on them in life would be what went through to the next life.
And in regard to that poll, I bet if you'd asked the people something more along the lines of "What do you fear more: public speaking or death?" how many people do you think would have said public speaking, and meant it?
Actually, you're both wrong.
The Pyramids were the embodiment of the Egyptian creation myth, and were built on command of the King but *not* because the High Priests told them to (I'm not going to go into it in detail, but the preservation of the King's body by mummification and the strength of his tomb-residence (of which the pyramid was the epitome) are the two important parts of this). It was not until much later that the High Priests (particularly of Amun) held that kind of power, and by then the Pyramids and their building were nothing more than a distant memory.
The Egyptians did not fear death - the opposite in fact. They feared a *foreign death*, certainly, but by the Middle Kingdom there was increased access to both the Osiris Cult and Pyramid or Coffin texts that would help to ensure passage into the eternal afterlife.
As for taking live servants with them...I've only ever seen evidence for minor live burials in pre-dynastic or early-dynastic Egypt. It was hardly a common practice (given one could essentially take all they needed into the next life by writing or drawing it upon tomb walls - the power of the written and spoken word) and has never been associated with pyramidal burial.
Sorry for posting with an alt account, but I currently don't have access to my Mord one 
So while a person may live for 10 or 15 more years, they are going to spend only 3-6 of that in the work force or otherwise being productive. Now this is not to say they dont' deserve a longer life. But lets think about this. How many of you have had to spend any time in a nursing home visiting an ailing family member, I know that I will put a bullet in my own head before I ever go through that myself. Most of these people are there due to old age, not something that Stem cell research can cure. Right now the only thing we have been promised is the ability to tack onto those last few years, not increase the quality of those years.
At this time the only thing that an increased life-span will do is put a larger burden upon family and society to support these people. And we are doing it mainly out of the selfish need to hold onto the ones we love when they should be allowed to pass on. I am just now coming to realize that this is something I am going to have to go so fairly soon with my parents. My father is almost 65 and in 10 years he will probably be in a situation where he is unable to take care of himself. It would be completely unfair to him to extend his life when his quality of life would be terrible.
In time they will extend the overall lifespan of people. a 30 year old then will be at the same point in their life as a 20 year old is now. This will be a wonderful thing and something that I look forward to even though it probably won't have an affect on my life. But all living things must die. At some point we have to accept that.
Faelynn LeAndris fucked around with this message on 06-20-2005 at 08:42 PM.
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Azizza spewed forth this undeniable truth:
The idea of a longer life span is all great until you really think about the overall impact on the individual and society. As the average life-span increases, the productivity of a person does not increase in proportion to the overall increased life.So while a person may live for 10 or 15 more years, they are going to spend only 3-6 of that in the work force or otherwise being productive. Now this is not to say they dont' deserve a longer life. But lets think about this. How many of you have had to spend any time in a nursing home visiting an ailing family member, I know that I will put a bullet in my own head before I ever go through that myself. Most of these people are there due to old age, not something that Stem cell research can cure. Right now the only thing we have been promised is the ability to tack onto those last few years, not increase the quality of those years.
At this time the only thing that an increased life-span will do is put a larger burden upon family and society to support these people. And we are doing it mainly out of the selfish need to hold onto the ones we love when they should be allowed to pass on. I am just now coming to realize that this is something I am going to have to go so fairly soon with my parents. My father is almost 65 and in 10 years he will probably be in a situation where he is unable to take care of himself. It would be completely unfair to him to extend his life when his quality of life would be terrible.
In time they will extend the overall lifespan of people. a 30 year old then will be at the same point in their life as a 20 year old is now. This will be a wonderful thing and something that I look forward to even though it probably won't have an affect on my life. But all living things must die. At some point we have to accept that.
I imagine the theraputic benefits for people still at or below working age will cause an increase in productivity that will more than pick up the slack. JooJooFlop fucked around with this message on 06-20-2005 at 08:48 PM.
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JooJooFlop was listening to Cher while typing:
I imagine the theraputic benefits for people still at or below working age will cause an increase in productivity that will more than pick up the slack.
Perhaps. We are still far to early in the advancement of this science to know the full benefits or how long it will take to reach the full benefits.
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How.... Kait.... uughhhhhh:
Yes, I spit out bits of croissant at that one.
Kudos to the witmaster Pvednes.Anyway, about the article.
It's both interesting and depressing that the reason this rich guy is donating so much money to stem cell research is so he can use the benefits on himself.
He's already pretty old and sickly-looking, it seems unrealistic for him to expect a breakthrough in his lifetime. then again, maybe he's just desperate. *shrug*It seems like the longer we extend our lives, the more we fear the inevitable end. In ancient and not-so-ancient times, especially among the poor classes, death was just an accepted way of life. Of course the security of the "opium of the masses" helped keep that blase feeling of "come what may" going, but even still, there is a great amount of religion today and yet you still run into people all the time who are terrified about death.
I don't understand what propagates this fear. Is it just that the more we know, the more we realize how much we don't know? That sounds corny, but it's the only reason I can come up with on my own.
He's not actually donating money to the research, he's paying for treatment with the clinic's new stem cell therapy, which recently had helped a man recover from a 2cm hepatic tumour in EIGHT WEEKS.
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We were all impressed when Pvednes wrote:
He's not actually donating money to the research, he's paying for treatment with the clinic's new stem cell therapy, which recently had helped a man recover from a 2cm hepatic tumour in EIGHT WEEKS.
Oh...I guess I misread the article, I'm sorry.
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Faelynn LeAndris attempted to be funny by writing:
Edit: Ahhh screw it, I never should have taken her off ignore... It burns.
That's nice.
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Everyone wondered WTF when Jing wrote:
Actually, you're both wrong.The Pyramids were the embodiment of the Egyptian creation myth, and were built on command of the King but *not* because the High Priests told them to (I'm not going to go into it in detail, but the preservation of the King's body by mummification and the strength of his tomb-residence (of which the pyramid was the epitome) are the two important parts of this). It was not until much later that the High Priests (particularly of Amun) held that kind of power, and by then the Pyramids and their building were nothing more than a distant memory.
The Egyptians did not fear death - the opposite in fact. They feared a *foreign death*, certainly, but by the Middle Kingdom there was increased access to both the Osiris Cult and Pyramid or Coffin texts that would help to ensure passage into the eternal afterlife.
As for taking live servants with them...I've only ever seen evidence for minor live burials in pre-dynastic or early-dynastic Egypt. It was hardly a common practice (given one could essentially take all they needed into the next life by writing or drawing it upon tomb walls - the power of the written and spoken word) and has never been associated with pyramidal burial.
Sorry for posting with an alt account, but I currently don't have access to my Mord one
Really? I always thought the priests had more power than that :\ Egyptian history is confusing and upsetting to me, so I choose to spend my time on Greek, Roman and medieval European history instead 
And I didn't mean that they took live servants with them, though some did. I was thinking more in reference to the treasures that would get packed in with them, and the clay sculptures representing servants that were supposed to be animate in the next life.
I still think it's funny that they threw the brain out because they thought it was useless...haha. Kait fucked around with this message on 06-21-2005 at 01:18 AM.
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There was much rejoicing when Kait said this:
I still think it's funny that they threw the brain out because they thought it was useless...haha.
Read your Zombie Survival Guide. This practice came about because if the mummy became a zombie, it would never decay due to the preservation process. Removing the brain is the only defense against zombification.
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From the book of Sakkra, chapter 3, verse 16:
Read your Zombie Survival Guide. This practice came about because if the mummy became a zombie, it would never decay due to the preservation process. Removing the brain is the only defense against zombification.
I wonder when the concept of zombies even came around, and what they were originally called. It would be interesting to research, but probably kind of difficult to find actual historical evidence and not random crap written up to look official :*(
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Kait stopped staring at Deedlit long enough to write:
I wonder when the concept of zombies even came around, and what they were originally called. It would be interesting to research, but probably kind of difficult to find actual historical evidence and not random crap written up to look official :*(
It's such a generic fear that there is no way it has a roots in any one part of the world or society. If you want the actual word zombie's origin, you'll have to sail a ways southeast of Florida.
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Father McKenzie wrote this stupid crap:
It's such a generic fear that there is no way it has a roots in any one part of the world or society. If you want the actual word zombie's origin, you'll have to sail a ways southeast of Florida.
Actually more east than southeast, as the word's origin is African.
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Azizza had this to say about pies:
Ok. First off I want to say I support Stem cell research as long as the cells used are not a result of abortion. And most used today are not.
The idea of a longer life span is all great until you really think about the overall impact on the individual and society. As the average life-span increases, the productivity of a person does not increase in proportion to the overall increased life.So while a person may live for 10 or 15 more years, they are going to spend only 3-6 of that in the work force or otherwise being productive. Now this is not to say they dont' deserve a longer life. But lets think about this. How many of you have had to spend any time in a nursing home visiting an ailing family member, I know that I will put a bullet in my own head before I ever go through that myself. Most of these people are there due to old age, not something that Stem cell research can cure. Right now the only thing we have been promised is the ability to tack onto those last few years, not increase the quality of those years.
At this time the only thing that an increased life-span will do is put a larger burden upon family and society to support these people. And we are doing it mainly out of the selfish need to hold onto the ones we love when they should be allowed to pass on. I am just now coming to realize that this is something I am going to have to go so fairly soon with my parents. My father is almost 65 and in 10 years he will probably be in a situation where he is unable to take care of himself. It would be completely unfair to him to extend his life when his quality of life would be terrible.
In time they will extend the overall lifespan of people. a 30 year old then will be at the same point in their life as a 20 year old is now. This will be a wonderful thing and something that I look forward to even though it probably won't have an affect on my life. But all living things must die. At some point we have to accept that.
Actually, the whole point is increasing quality of life over the current later years. The longer life is (at present) more a side effect of that increased quality of life. It makes old men feel as if they're in the prime of their lives, and I think that's something that is worthwhile.
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This one time, at JooJooFlop camp:
The secret is Calgon.
Ancient Chinies secret, huh.
(My husband some hotshot)
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We were all impressed when Freschel Spindrift wrote:
Ancient Chinies secret, huh.(My husband some hotshot)
...what
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Pvednes thought about the meaning of life:
Actually, the whole point is increasing quality of life over the current later years. The longer life is (at present) more a side effect of that increased quality of life. It makes old men feel as if they're in the prime of their lives, and I think that's something that is worthwhile.
I agree with you. My point is just that at this point we are not increasing the quality of life at the same rate we are increasing the life-span. This will change over time of course. I guess my point was that while this may help our generation, and will without question help our children's, it isn't going to do anything but extend the suffering for the current 50+ crowd.
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Sakkra had this to say about Tron:
Actually more east than southeast, as the word's origin is African.
Really?! Wow, that's fantastic. I always thought it came from Britain.
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Sakkra had this to say about Tron:
Actually more east than southeast, as the word's origin is African.
I was pretty sure it came straight out of the West Indies, the word zombi being used to describe the dead bodies with half their souls bound in a jar and the other half bound in the body still in the Vodoun religion (Voodoo, for the less PC). There is an African word that's "nzambi" that means 'god', but doesn't really have any ties to undead. Zombi is closer to zombie anyway.
I know the OED mentions a snake god as well, but as far as I've read, most people who've researched the word can't find a snake god with any ties to the word zombie. Father McKenzie fucked around with this message on 06-21-2005 at 03:33 PM.
It's West African in origin, getting it's modern meaning through the voodoo cults of the West Indies and Haiti.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
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There was much rejoicing when Kait said this:
fucktard pharaohs
Not to split hairs, but assuming you ARE an expert on medieval times, which I doubt you are (More likely a hobbyist historian), but speaking on your alleged credentials, on what grounds are you, by the by, qualified to classify pharaohs as fucktards?
Is it as tenuous as Maradon's ability to speak about the Middle Ages? If so, you may wish, in the future, to watch where you swing your righteous indignation.
Ahem.
That having been said, the article starting this thread points out once again that the cyberpunk author sorts do get it right. When we get our vat grown replacements, they will come from the Sino-Chiba communist collective.
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
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Bloodsage had this to say about Optimus Prime:
*Opens his OED with a thud*It's West African in origin, getting it's modern meaning through the voodoo cults of the West Indies and Haiti.
Hee, somebody is getting cursed now. Pvednes fucked around with this message on 06-21-2005 at 08:28 PM.
