Since we have a number of parents on the boards, what are your feelings on using Corporal Punishment? Agree or disagree, do you like the idea that the choice could be taken away from you?
I grew up with Corporal Punishment at home if we acted real bad or at school early on (Elementary days), though I think there should be a line with it. Discipline your child as you need but don't let it turn into a beating or abuse and I don't think they should take the option of corporal punishment from a parent. It's only a leap and a hop from declaring being grounded as tramatic mental abuse on a child, etc.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
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Karnaj had this to say about pies:
Just because you make something illegal doesn't mean it'll go away.
True, but if it goes through then it's alot easier for parents who use it to be taken to court over it.
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
Making WASHING MOUTHS OUT WITH SOAP illegal?
Crap on a crutch, I wanna slap somebody for even suggesting that. (I can count on one hand the number of times my mom had to resort to doing that to me or any of my siblings.)
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JooJooFlop's fortune cookie read:
What schools need these days is The Chokey.
YES
Some people are like Slinkys... Not really good for anything, But they still bring a smile to your face when you push them down a flight of stairs.
Not that banning fractions is any better, mind you...
Some kids never need a spanking in thier lives, others need to get pops just about every day. Thats just the way it is. My Nephew for instance if he ever acted up, I never had to touch the boy, ever.. Merely raising my voice or expressing disappointment straitened him up. My oldest on the other hand ususally ends up getting pops by the end of the day, and I am very lenient. My method gets them through several chances before it even comes up.
They get a three strike rule, and I dont mean strikes for being a kid, I mean things like running off in a crowded shopping center or playing with something dangerous that they shouldn't. Where they will simply get a warning. This will happen 3 times and they I start counting off pops begining with one. Thats open handed on the butt pops mind you. And they will basically get three more chances with those, before it escalates to using the paddle. Which it rarely comes to. The paddle is more of a threat device than a tool. Usually the most the girls have ever gotten was 2 or 3 open handed pops on the butt.
This is not a legal issue and it never should be, its just stupidity.
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This one time, at Faelynn LeAndris camp:
This is not a legal issue and it never should be, its just stupidity.
It isn't anything but a legal issue since the whole point of the debate is weather criminal penalties that assualting others usually carries should be suspended in cases of parents hitting their kids.
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Mod was naked while typing this:
It isn't anything but a legal issue since the whole point of the debate is weather criminal penalties that assualting others usually carries should be suspended in cases of parents hitting their kids.
Yes, and as my responce implies making parents legally liable for thier form of discipline in the case of spankings (We are not talking abuse and beatings here) is stupidity. So what's your point?
This is not a legal issue, trying to make it as such is stupidity.
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Kait stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
I have the sudden urge to reread Starship Troopers. o.o
Wait... What?
ABUSING someone, on the other hand, is a power play. It's not about what you did. It's about an assertion of dominance, and therefore usually resorts to damaging the other individual. That's why I think a lot of places flat out took the ability, even with parental consent, away from principals and teachers. When you're dealing with a third party like that, it's hard to tell where discipline ends and assertion of dominance begins.
The only difference between adult-on-child abuse and child-on-child abuse is that child-on-child abuse is usually more straightforward in terms of cruelty, and is usually overlooked as being part of growing up (which it is, within reason).
Discipline, on the other hand, is to better the person on the whole, rather than destroy. A parent criminally liable for abusing their child (IE damaging them physically) is perfectly okay. A parent criminally liable for disciplining their child is not okay. What would be next? Wrongful imprisonment charges for grounding your child?
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
How many of those same people turned around and threatened to turn their parents in for abuse?
I blame the school systems for this really. They bury it in the kids minds that "if ANYONE, even family, touches you in a way you dont like.. report them." and that its OK to tell the truth about something like that. So naturally, when they get spanked for doing something wrong.. they go to their teachers and all they have to say is "My mother / father hits me" BAM! All hell breaks loose and CPS is beating down the door.
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KaLourin stopped beating up furries long enough to write:
Show of hands please. How many people here got swatted, belted on the ass, grabbed by the back of the neck for doing something wrong when they were young?How many of those same people turned around and threatened to turn their parents in for abuse?
I got belted on the ass if I made below a C.
I'm perfectly content with my life as of right now 
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KaLourin got all f'ed up on Angel Dust and wrote:
How many of those same people turned around and threatened to turn their parents in for abuse?
I did. My dad said "Go ahead, they'll just take you away."
That shut me up real quick.
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There was much rejoicing when Fox said this:
I'd be fine with it. Unless they made it so that when you are older it is fine for you to hit your parents when they do wrong.
And you're a dumbass... That was just a retarded statement.
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Meow meow meow meow. Meow meow meow meow. Meow meow meow meow KaLourin meow meow meow.
Show of hands please. How many people here got swatted, belted on the ass, grabbed by the back of the neck for doing something wrong when they were young?How many of those same people turned around and threatened to turn their parents in for abuse?
Yah, I got spanked. My parents had an old paint stirring stick. That thing was twice as thick as it started out as, because of all the paint on it. That's what they used.
We never tried to report them or anything. Never thought of it as an option. We did hide the paint stick, though. They got another one, but it was cheap wood with no paint on it, and it broke.
Lyinar Ka`Bael, Piney Fresh Druidess - Luclin
I can honestly say though, I was never punished for anything school related. But I could see a reason for it. I personally think taking freedoms away for school items is considerably more effective.
Pussification of America, that is what things like this are. Where is that eagle smiley when ya need it. 
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Faelynn LeAndris was being a tard:
And you're a dumbass... That was just a retarded statement.
First, fuck you. You do not know where that view is based on. How about you go and have your father with a bad temper go to "discipline" you, and end up recieving more than he intended to do. How much is enough, and can you guarentee that you fully understand a childs pain limits? It gives excuse to take your anger out on your kids, when they do something wrong. It can cause lasting effects on children such as emotional withdrawal, if done more than what the child can appropriately handle.
Gee, however are we gonna give our children a lesson, if we can't hit them?
If you want to think it is retarded, fine. However, that is your opinion. Fox fucked around with this message on 06-09-2005 at 11:29 PM.
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Fox startled the peaceful upland Gorillas by blurting:
First, fuck you. You do not know where that view is based on. How about you go and have your father with a bad temper go to "discipline" you, and end up recieving more than he intended to do. How much is enough, and can you guarentee that you fully understand a childs pain limits? It gives excuse to take your anger out on your kids, when they do something wrong. It can cause lasting effects on children such as emotional withdrawal, if done more than what the child can appropriately handle.Gee, however are we gonna give our children a lesson, if we can't hit them?
If you want to think it is retarded, fine. However, that is your opinion.
Sorry, but that was still a stupid thing to say. "OMG, you just can't understand my pain!" doesn't change that.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
When I taught in Texas teachers could still paddle students for discipline problems. Even the high school students I taught got "licks" on occasion. It was more a matter of humiliation than reinforcement through pain.
Each year when the student handbook was passed out, it included a waiver that parents would not sue the school if legitimate corporal punishment was handed out.
I did get to see both sides of the abuse issue, kids coming to school black and blue because their drunken father would take out his pain on his kids. Or the young girl who picked fights with her doped up mother every night just so her mom would beat her up instead of her little brother. It is painful to look at and requires a judgment call on when to confront a student about it, since some abuse leaves no physical marks or can be easily hidden by clothing. The knee jerk reaction was to instantly report any potential abuse to CPS the moment a student came forward. The problem of course was that often the kids were just attention starved or trying to get even for some silly slight. This, of course, clogged up the system and prevents the kids who really need help from getting it. What was worse was that word the kid ratted out their mom or day would get back to the parent before CPS could intervene. I saw one boy hospitalized for three weeks because his father beat him to within an inch of his life with a re-bar after hearing that his son had accused him of abuse.
The biggest problem here is that the line between punishment and abuse is not clearly drawn. Is three swats with a leather belt across the butt ok? How about 5? 7? 10? 25? At what point should a teacher report abuse? Should a school take it upon itself to investigate reported abuse before calling CPS? How involved should a public school really be in the parenting process, especially for the kids who have parents lacking those skills?
It is a tough issue, but passing a law that just bans corporal punishment is not the answer. No law is going to keep parents from disciplining their kids, nor will it keep bad parents from physically abusing them. Worse it opens the door for kids, whom for whatever reason, just wish to strike out at their otherwise good parents.
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When the babel fish was in place, it was apparent Bloodsage said:
Sorry, but that was still a stupid thing to say. "OMG, you just can't understand my pain!" doesn't change that.
Excuse me, but I thought this was called a conversation. Someone opposed what I was saying, so I followed through by explaining in more detail my viewpoints on the subject at hand. I am still closely examining my post, but I am unable to determine ever typing "OMG". Or anything else you are trying to shrewdly suggest to attempt to de-validate my opinion. So as I repeat, that's just my thoughts on the matter at this time.
Tyewa has pretty much well summed up my thoughts on this. Maybe it's not the answer to outlaw it, but it seemed like a decent possibility. Fox fucked around with this message on 06-10-2005 at 12:04 AM.
Face it: saying that parents shouldn't be able to spank their kids unless their kids are allowed to beat them up later in life is simply a stupid thing to say.
--Satan, quoted by John Milton
Too bad all three troublemakers in this thread have me on ignore, but tee hee anyways.
And stupid is just an opinion as well. Pbbth! Fox fucked around with this message on 06-10-2005 at 12:12 AM.
Whether you believe in spanking/hitting sure as hell seems to be dependent on how you were raised. It seems that most people in this thread go along with how they were raised themselves(exception maybe to those who were abused, but we aren't really talking about that). Zair fucked around with this message on 06-10-2005 at 01:38 AM.
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Faelynn LeAndris wrote this then went back to looking for porn:
There are already so many reports coming out of CPS of rebellious ansty kids using the "I'll Call CPS!" threat on parents these days as it is, all this will do is make it easier for that to happen.
That backfires sometimes though.
"If you touch me I'll phone children's aid!"
"What did you say?"
"I said I'll phone children's aid!"
"Well, let me get you the phone then, tough guy."
"But.. but.. if I call them you'll get in trouble!"
"Oh, I might get in a little bit of trouble. But I know it will take them ten minutes to get here. And in that time somebody gonna get a hurt real bad."
(I forgot that guy's name. I posted a video of his stand up a few months ago and can't find it again. Some Indian guy. Hilarity.)
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Fox had this to say about Duck Tales:
I'd be fine with it. Unless they made it so that when you are older it is fine for you to hit your parents when they do wrong.
wasn't a joke?
...
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Peanut butter ass Shaq Zair booooze lime pole over bench lick:
I'm not really a believer in physical punishment.
Haha, you don't say!
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Whether you believe in spanking/hitting sure as hell seems to be dependent on how you were raised. It seems that most people in this thread go along with how they were raised themselves(exception maybe to those who were abused, but we aren't really talking about that).
I was very seldom spanked and almost never punished, but I still believe that spankings are an integral part of child development.
There is a clear and obvious difference between discipline and abuse. If you cannot make this distinction, you are an idiot.
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Maradon! had this to say about the Spice Girls:
There is a clear and obvious difference between discipline and abuse. If you cannot make this distinction, you are an idiot.
I wouldn't say it's always clear. How many hits with a belt are discipline? How many are abuse? Where is the line exactly?
Also, you say you were sometimes spanked. Your parents thought spanking was an acceptable discipline and so do you. How does that go against what I said about most people's discipline methods matching closely to that of their parents?
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Zair stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
I wouldn't say it's always clear. How many hits with a belt are discipline? How many are abuse? Where is the line exactly?
It's not really how many, it's the attitude the parent takes when disciplining.
In my opinion, anyway... Gadani fucked around with this message on 06-10-2005 at 02:41 AM.
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Gadani thought about the meaning of life:
It's not really how many, it's the attitude the parent takes when disciplining.In my opinion, anyway...
I would say the severity of the punishment and the attitude with which it is carried out are both important factors.
To say that the severity of the punishment hardly matters when defining abuse seems wrong to me. Both factors are important.
The "clear line" Maradon talks about, in regards to attitude, DOES seem clear to me, but the clear line in regards to severity does not.
But I guess that doesn't matter if you don't think severity matters. Zair fucked around with this message on 06-10-2005 at 02:48 AM.
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Zair's unholy Backstreet Boys obsession manifested in:
I wouldn't say it's always clear. How many hits with a belt are discipline? How many are abuse? Where is the line exactly?
Me personally? I'd say if it leaves anything more than a red mark. Stinging, temporary pain, and making a hand-shaped red mark on their ass, sure. Leaving a bruise, heck no. If you're just causing pain, ok. Causing DAMAGE, no.
But that's just me.
