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Topic: Any Linux Gurus out there?
Noxhil
Pancake
posted 01-22-2004 09:10:50 PM
If there are any resident Linux gurus here that would like to field a few questions, I would appreciate it greatly. These are some basic questions, and are largely opinion-based.

1. What Linux OS do you recommend. I've downloaded ISOs of Fedora Core, and Red Hat 9.0 and am also looking at SuSE. What, in your opinion, is the best of these. I've heard a lot of good things about Fedora Core, but I honestly don't even know if it has a GUI... I don't really feel at home with command prompt only.

2. Would a cheap computer like this be sufficient to run any version of Linux I might choose? I have a computer sitting on the floor here and its specs are roughly the same. Also... if I reformat it to put Linux on, what is the deal with compatability of drivers for basic things such as mobo ethernet etc? IE, am I going to find out that my motherboard simply won't work with Linux and be SOL?

3. How easy/difficult is installation going to be? I understand installing any OS can have a range of difficulty associated with it, however, am I going to be sitting at my computer for 10+ hours trying to get this to work? And relating to that, will the computer have trouble joining my home network?

Well, that's all I can think of atm. If anyone could help me, I would very much appreciate it.

Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 01-22-2004 09:30:04 PM
(1) Most of it is personal preferences these days. I'm using my own custom build of linux, prior to that I liked RedHat. I know that Huroya uses Debian and I think there were one or 2 people around messing with Gentoo...

Fedora Core is basically RedHat 9.1 for the most part. It will have X (the GUI base) and several window managers to choose from (Most people tend to side with either KDE or Gnome).

(2) If you're going to use X, you're gonna need a decent box. Last time I tinkered with X I was on a Celeton 900 with 512Mb of ram and it was still a bit sluggish at times. X is a resource hog but it does VERY will with the interface display. Getting to know linux, it's not going to be much of a problem, but don't expect "to-die-for" performance.

(3) Most people get through their first install of a 'major' distro in a few hours. If you go with RH, FC or Mandrake there are a ton of available config scripts and other things to make life simple for you once you've finished the install and booted the machine properly. As far as the others go, I assume that there are similar things, but I can't speak from experience on them.

* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Drysart
Pancake
posted 01-22-2004 09:33:08 PM
I'd recommend Fedora as a good distro to get started with. It has GUI tools for just about everything, and it's well supported. Once you cut your teeth on it, you might want to start looking at other distros to see if one suits your needs better, but don't get ahead of yourself.
Rabidbunnylover
Pancake
posted 01-22-2004 09:43:24 PM
quote:
Gembolah had this to say about John Romero:
If there are any resident Linux gurus here that would like to field a few questions, I would appreciate it greatly. These are some basic questions, and are largely opinion-based.

1. What Linux OS do you recommend. I've downloaded ISOs of Fedora Core, and Red Hat 9.0 and am also looking at SuSE. What, in your opinion, is the best of these. I've heard a lot of good things about Fedora Core, but I honestly don't even know if it has a GUI... I don't really feel at home with command prompt only.



I personally use Gentoo, because its package management system is somewhere around godly. However, I'd probably recommened Mandrake for a newbie, since it does a lot of auto-configuration stuff for you. I haven't played with any of the recent Red Hat related stuff, and I've never used SuSE, though. Knoppix is also good if you're just playing around and want to make it easy to recover from a screw-up.

Btw, Linux "flavors" are called distributions, and the GUI is called XWindows or XFree86 or simply X. If Fedora doesn't come with X, it's the first mainstream distribution I've heard of in a long, long time that doesn't.

quote:


2. Would a cheap computer like this be sufficient to run any version of Linux I might choose? I have a computer sitting on the floor here and its specs are roughly the same. Also... if I reformat it to put Linux on, what is the deal with compatability of drivers for basic things such as mobo ethernet etc? IE, am I going to find out that my motherboard simply won't work with Linux and be SOL?


Linux will run on basically anything. It's just a question of speed. My best guess is that that'll be usable, but not particularly fast. It should work for your first Linux box. Wired ethernet shouldn't be a problem (I've had more wired cards that didn't play nice with Windows than ones that didn't play nice with Linux). Areas that are traditionally desktop only (sound and video) usually prove more troublesome.

quote:


3. How easy/difficult is installation going to be? I understand installing any OS can have a range of difficulty associated with it, however, am I going to be sitting at my computer for 10+ hours trying to get this to work? And relating to that, will the computer have trouble joining my home network?


Depending on how customized you want your installation, it can take anywhere from two minutes actually at the computer (using Knoppix to install) to hours and hours (doing Linux from Scratch). Your first install will probably be in the one to two hour range, with much of that being unattended time. Of course, just like with Windows, if you have driver problems, it'll take longer. You should be able to get a basic system up and running fairly quickly, though.
Merp
Toktuk
Pooh Ogre
Keeper of the Shoulders of Peachis Perching
posted 01-22-2004 10:13:23 PM
1. It depends on where you want to go with Linux. If you're interested in learning about how it works and furthering your skills, start with Fedora or SuSE and move out to more "hardcore" distros from there (Debian, Slackware, Gentoo). If you're interested in have a desktop replacement for Windows and don't care about what's going on behind the scenes, I highly recommend Xandros with CrossOver Office and CrossOver Plugin (it's pricey, though).

2. You should check with the vendors of your hardware to see if they are Linux compatible. Like RIG said, if you're going to run X, make sure you have a decent video card and plenty of RAM. If you have a Winmodem, ditch it and get a real one ASAP.

3. It normally takes longer for me to install Windows than it does to install Red Hat, but I go and remove a lot of schlock that Red Hat installs by default that I don't need. Your installation time will be much shorter if you're installing Linux on it's own system. The best thing you can learn to do is RTFM.

-Tok

Noxhil
Pancake
posted 01-22-2004 10:15:11 PM
quote:
Everyone wondered WTF when Random Insanity Generator wrote:
(and several window managers to choose from (Most people tend to side with either KDE or Gnome)

Window manager... what is that?

Toktuk
Pooh Ogre
Keeper of the Shoulders of Peachis Perching
posted 01-22-2004 10:32:04 PM
quote:
Gembolah was listening to Cher while typing:
Window manager... what is that?

The primary GUI system that is used on Linux is called X Windows (specifically, it's a free version of X called XFree86). It's kind of hard to explain to people who have never used a Unix before because it doesn't really work the way that Windows does. X just displays GUI programs. It does nothing else. You can't move windows, you don't have any application bars or icons or anything like that. What has been created are programs that work with X Windows to give you tools like you would have in another desktop operating system - wallpapers, screensavers, an application bar, desktop icons, etc.

Windows managers are programs that allow you to manipulate Windows (change the size of the window, move them around the screen, minimize/maximize, etc.). Windows managers, by themselves, are very minimalistic.

Then there are desktop environments, which give you all the features of a full desktop operating system and include their own window managers. These are what most people use. The most popular desktop environments are GNOME and KDE. I personally prefer GNOME, because it has a very consistant look and feel, and they have a good human interface guideline that all developers try to follow and adhere to.

-Tok

Noxhil
Pancake
posted 01-22-2004 10:47:14 PM
Ahh ok, well, thank you for the help. I think I have gotten down these basic concepts so now I can finally understand what the FAQs are talking about. Thanks for helping me with some basic terminology, as well as some advice )
Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 01-22-2004 11:06:41 PM
No problem. Most *nix users are opinionated so you do have to watch out a bit for some of the wang waving that goes on (ie: Slackware (suckware) vs RedHat (red splat) vs SuSE, etc, etc) but in general, linux is linux. Different distributions will do things differently (RH stores the conf files in one location, but Slackware will store them in a different place) so you can't take any README file or HOW-TO file as gospel. In some cases you will have to think for yourself still, but I'm assuming you're not objectionable to that since you're taking it upon yourself to even start playing with linux.

Just as long as you don't go BSD on us I'm sure people won't mind answering questions. ehhe

* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Cherveny
Papaya
posted 01-22-2004 11:38:24 PM
I've used both Red Hat and Mandrake for years (used to use SLS and Slackware back in the days of the 0.9X Kernels). They are pretty much equivalent these days.

Best thing to do is just try picking one and seeing if you like the way it looks/feels.

Installing Linux these days is a BREEZE compared to what it used to be like. It used to be like pulling teeth to get X configured manually, and get through the manual install process, but now, most distributions have nice graphical installation routines that make things very straight forward.


As for whether that machine will be powerful enough, it all depends on what you plan to do. I have Linux running as a server on a Pentium Pro 200, with 128MB ram. It runs just fine, but can be a bit slow if running large X applications or compiling a large program (like re-compiling the kernel.)

If this machine can handle the load, that machine you listed should definately handle it.

Random Insanity Generator
Condom Ninja El Supremo
posted 01-22-2004 11:43:27 PM
Mandrake is Redhat pratically... If you've used one, you've used both... heh
* NullDevice kicks the server. "Floggings will continue until processing power improves!"
-----------------------------------
"That was black magic, and it was easy to use. Easy and fun. Like Legos." -- Harry Dresden
-----------------------------------
That's what playing Ragnarok Online taught me: There's no problem in the universe that can't be resolved by the proper application of daggers to faces.
Kermitov
Pancake
posted 01-23-2004 01:16:14 PM
I've used Slackware exclusively through all my Linux days. I would say that it's easy but again... we're talking 6 years of using it here... it's familiar by now.

There's been a lot of talk about Fedora on the Linux list that I'm on. Many suggest SuSE and in fact I got my friend to install that... he's not a computer person at all and he installed and can use it just fine.

Before buying a box go through the hardware lists and make sure everything is compatible.


oh BTW, they used to say that if you wanted something that was patterned after a real UNIX setup that Slackware was the way to go as they pretty much store everything in the same places. Not sure if that's still the case but it's something to consider. RedHat made a lot of waves a while back by going to a nonstandard setup.

[ 01-23-2004: Message edited by: Kermitov ]

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