I wanna take it really careful on the car. I usually shift at 3500RPM. I don't wanna get going so slow, though. The car is approaching the 1,000 mile mark, so it's near broken in.
Should I ignore how painfully slow I get going sometimes or take the tach a little further in the first couple gears?
Here's the gear list for reference.
quote:
1 : 3.166:1
2 : 2.050:1
3 : 1.481:1
4 : 1.166:1
5 : 0.916:1
6 : 0.725:1
Final drive : 4.529:1
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
My truck has a redline of 5,750. Typically, I shift in and around 4,000 in first, second, and third. So we'll say I use 70% of my engine's range for accelerating under normal conditions.
If we extrapolate for your car, we have a shift point of around 5,600 RPM or so for first, second, and third. However, your first, second, and third are like my second, second and a half, and third, due to my truck's insanely low gearing. Also, your engine's stronger than mine, so you'll produce more power at 70% of your range than I will.
Given all these factors, I'd recommend ramping your shift points up to 5,000 for first and second, and shift according to the road for the other four gears. And, of course, I'd ramp it up to 7,500 in every gear if you have to impress chicks.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
Sorta neat.
quote:
Bill's account was hax0red to write:
If I fiddle with my gas pedal, I can sorta keep my automatic transmission from shifting up.Sorta neat.
Having a big lever to shift around is cooler. You can pretend it's some retro-steampunk anime mecha.
sigpic courtesy of This Guy, original modified by me
quote:
Karnaj's fortune cookie read:
IIRC, the Matrix XRS has an 8,000 RPM redline. Keep that in mind.My truck has a redline of 5,750. Typically, I shift in and around 4,000 in first, second, and third. So we'll say I use 70% of my engine's range for accelerating under normal conditions.
If we extrapolate for your car, we have a shift point of around 5,600 RPM or so for first, second, and third. However, your first, second, and third are like my second, second and a half, and third, due to my truck's insanely low gearing. Also, your engine's stronger than mine, so you'll produce more power at 70% of your range than I will.
Given all these factors, I'd recommend ramping your shift points up to 5,000 for first and second, and shift according to the road for the other four gears. And, of course, I'd ramp it up to 7,500 in every gear if you have to impress chicks.
Ja`Deth, the guide book gives 1k as the break-in. So, I'm there.
And wow, Karnaj, I've been going low power! I need to start asking a little more of my car than I am, I suppose. It has a "cam switch" at 6,000 RPM. I won't pretend to ask what that means, all I know is that it means I get about 60 more horsepower if I drive above 6,000 RPM. Redline is 8200 RPM, so the numbers your provided are close.
If it's only for accelerating in a brief period, it probably won't burn up a whole lot more fuel to shift around 4500-5000RPM, then? It definitely seems like the transmission intends me to shift with more revs than I currently do.
One last comment...it seems like revving from a complete stop just a little before letting up the clutch can squeak the tires, but it makes going almost a sure thing such that the car won't stall. I don't kill it very often any more, but my beginning take off is very slow in order to just get the car rolling. Any advice on this one? [ 05-20-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
Ja'Deth Issar Ka'bael's account was hax0red to write:
Having a big lever to shift around is cooler. You can pretend it's some retro-steampunk anime mecha.
Yeah, but the feeling wears off after a while, and then you realize that hand could be doing other things, like unsnapping a bra, or fiddling with the radio.
I run my firebird to hell and back in just normal driving. Gotta love the sound of the eight cylinders roar at 5000rpms with my Dynomax Turbo exhaust, no cats,free flowing headers, and straight test pipe. Shakes the ground.
quote:[/QUOTE]
Where's Waisz? impressed everyone with:
My Toyota Matrix has a wide transmission. It's a lot like a Celica's. This doesn't do much for someone who wants to drive in an everyday situation and get going without getting passed by everyone.
I wanna take it really careful on the car. I usually shift at 3500RPM. I don't wanna get going so slow, though. The car is approaching the 1,000 mile mark, so it's near broken in.
Should I ignore how painfully slow I get going sometimes or take the tach a little further in the first couple gears?
Here's the gear list for reference.
[QUOTE]1 : 3.166:1
2 : 2.050:1
3 : 1.481:1
4 : 1.166:1
5 : 0.916:1
6 : 0.725:1
Final drive : 4.529:1
You should break the car in how you will eventually drive it normally. after 1,000 miles you should be able to rev it however high you want. all the burrs and metal shavings should be gone.
quote:
Bill's unholy Backstreet Boys obsession manifested in:
Yeah, but the feeling wears off after a while, and then you realize that hand could be doing other things, like unsnapping a bra, or fiddling with the radio.
You can still do those things. The shifting comes in when you're accelerating, but if you're out cruising, you'll be in one gear a lot of the time anyway.
On another note, I've been reading that the Matrix is a 'riceable' car. To modify or not to modify...
quote:
Yuri had this to say about Duck Tales:
I just listen to the motor.. Shift when it sounds like it's getting higher up. Never really looked at RPM when I'm driving.
It seems my engine gets twice as loud for every 1000RPM.
This can be misleading sometimes.
And now I've decided "HEY! I'M IN HIGH SCHOOL! I DON'T OFTEN PAY FOR GAS! FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, DRIVE THAT CAR LIKE THERE'S NO TOMORROW!"
That's that. [ 05-20-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
Where's Waisz?'s account was hax0red to write:
You can still do those things. The shifting comes in when you're accelerating, but if you're out cruising, you'll be in one gear a lot of the time anyway.On another note, I've been reading that the Matrix is a 'riceable' car. To modify or not to modify...
if you're planning on adding a body kit, a pair of 1000w subs, some cold cathodes and a muffler with a resonator, then the anser is NO.
If you're planning on ripping out the exhaust from the block back and adding free flowing headers/pipes/cats, opening up your intake system with new filters, and maybe tossing on a turbo for forced induction, then YES. (as well as tweaking timings, and maybe even getting a performance chip) Then maybe adding aftermarket rims/tires for a little more grip as well as new suspension for better cornering.
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
The logic train ran off the tracks when Burger said:
if you're planning on adding a body kit, a pair of 1000w subs, some cold cathodes and a muffler with a resonator, then the anser is NO.If you're planning on ripping out the exhaust from the block back and adding free flowing headers/pipes/cats, opening up your intake system with new filters, and maybe tossing on a turbo for forced induction, then YES. (as well as tweaking timings, and maybe even getting a performance chip) Then maybe adding aftermarket rims/tires for a little more grip as well as new suspension for better cornering.
Funny, I was just looking at some Toyota warrantied cold air intakes and exhaust that give the car a low growl (plus give it ~10 more horsepower). A little pricey, but that's what a summer job is for.
Supposedly, there may be a Toyota warrantied supercharger at some point, too. [ 05-20-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
Burger had this to say about Robocop:
if you're planning on adding a body kit, a pair of 1000w subs, some cold cathodes and a muffler with a resonator, then the anser is NO.If you're planning on ripping out the exhaust from the block back and adding free flowing headers/pipes/cats, opening up your intake system with new filters, and maybe tossing on a turbo for forced induction, then YES. (as well as tweaking timings, and maybe even getting a performance chip) Then maybe adding aftermarket rims/tires for a little more grip as well as new suspension for better cornering.
Theres nothing wrong with show, as long as there's go behind it. All show n no go is garbage.
quote:
ACES! Another post by Kirane:
Theres nothing wrong with show, as long as there's go behind it. All show n no go is garbage.
yes, but typically, these days, people do go all show, no go if they go for show at all.
I mean yeah, some people have the goods to back it up, but they're in the minority.
No, Really. Bite me.
quote:
Where's Waisz? thought about the meaning of life:
You can still do those things. The shifting comes in when you're accelerating, but if you're out cruising, you'll be in one gear a lot of the time anyway.
Here in PA, you're never crusing for more than six or seven minutes at a stretch, unless you're driving 15mph.
quote:
Bill had this to say about the Spice Girls:
Here in PA, you're never crusing for more than six or seven minutes at a stretch, unless you're driving 15mph.
Highways = 
(not that you can really "cruise" in my area, either. cruising in suburbs seems to be an oxymoron)
On another note, what is the relationship between TRD (Toyota Racing Development) and Toyota? Does Toyota support TRD parts? Will it destroy my warranty to have TRD parts in the car? I've read it won't, but where do the parts have to be installed to keep the car's warranty? [ 05-20-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
Nobody really understood why Karnaj wrote:
...My truck has a redline of 5,750. Typically, I shift in and around 4,000 in first, second, and third. So we'll say I use 70% of my engine's range for accelerating under normal conditions.
....
What Type of truck do you drive?, I normally shift my F-150 at 2500-3000rpm, little bit higher if I am raceing, but then I only get 3 speeds, never use granny gear cept when towing.
As for the car, My dad taught me rule of thumb about 3000, reving it up any higher really a waste of gas unless your raceing the thing--I imagine some were in the owners manual it will tell you the area the car was designed to shift from.
quote:
Bill Model 2000 was programmed to say:
Here in PA, you're never crusing for more than six or seven minutes at a stretch, unless you're driving 15mph.
This is true, in my exile to pittsburgh, I came to the conclusion you exist in two states there:
1. Goin up a hill
2. Goin down a hill
needless to say, the city does not lend itself well to manual driving
however here in South Carolina, the stretches of road are LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG
I am definatly seeking a manual in my next car, which hopefully will be a late f-body
Granted, they get you absolutely nowhere (Whee, let's go out even FARTHER into bumfucksville!), but you can cruise.
[ 05-20-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
It seems a lot of Matrix owners do give a little gas (get up to about 2000RPM) before letting off the clutch when getting going. The Matrix's transmission is...unique.
As for the turbo Matrix, the general rule of thumb is 10hp per psi, so for 100hp that would be 10psi... assuming the engine has stock internals that probably wouldn't work too weell. If it did, its reliability would be shit because the stock parts aren't designed to handle a lot of boost.
As for the cam switch, it's Toyota's VVT-i thing, which is basically VTEC (if you get my meaning). More or less, you have 2 camshafts (DOHC). An intake cam and an exhaust cam. The cams actuate rockers which in turn move the valves and let air/fuel into the cylinder and exhaust out.
That above picture is your normal operating cams (below 6000rpm). The extra "High RPM Lobe" doesn't do anything at this point, it actuates a follower which isn't connected to anything and thus just moves back and forth to no effect. As you can see, the top rocker is being operated by the shorter low-RPM lobe, and the bottom rocker is being operated by a different low-RPM lobe.
However, when you pass your cam switch (in your case 6000rpm) a solenoid makes oil pressure push a rod through the rockers and the follower, making it so that the high-RPM lobe (which has a longer duration thus allowing more air/fuel in and more exhaust out) is now operating.
In that picture you can see that the longer duration high-RPM lobe is operating both rockers now. When you go below 6000rpm again, the oil pressure falls and it returns to the way it was in the first picture.
Hope that helped you understand variable valve timing a little bit... it's one of the things they teach you in the Ricer Academy and since I know I'm glad to help
quote:
Peter probably says this to all the girls:
What Type of truck do you drive?, I normally shift my F-150 at 2500-3000rpm, little bit higher if I am raceing, but then I only get 3 speeds, never use granny gear cept when towing.As for the car, My dad taught me rule of thumb about 3000, reving it up any higher really a waste of gas unless your raceing the thing--I imagine some were in the owners manual it will tell you the area the car was designed to shift from.
haha, my ranger doesn't even have a tach.
learn to shift by ear, it'll help you in the long run.
How do you know when to shift? well in my truck the exhaust note hits that *just so* sound and there you go.
and Jaggedpine! Thanks a lot, I always wondered about that. [ 05-21-2003: Message edited by: Kermitov ]
Side note: YOU'VE HAD THE CAR FOR 6 MONTHS AND YOU'RE JUST NOW HITTING 1000 MILES?!?!
You made a comment about a Toyota Warranted Supercharger, speaking from experience, toyota uses Turbo's. You can most likely use the stock turbo the Celica GT-S AWD model uses. And you will have to get it installed by a Toyota tech to have it warranted. I can't be for sure on this. Also speaking from experience, once you Turbo/supercharge a car that wasn't sold with it, but you can buy other models with it, the warranty is no longer valid.
If you have any other questions about after market parts or any questions at all, talk to Jagged or myself. Jagged surely knows what he is talking about, just look at his sig! WRX pwns all! =D [ 05-21-2003: Message edited by: Ninok ]
quote:
Verily, Sergeant Blindy doth proclaim:
You should run the XRS up to 5-6.5 grand every gear for normal driving. If you want to go fast, run it up to redline. Small engines are designed to be ran to red line. thats what their for, thats the only way they make power, that's how you enjoy driving them.
Side note: YOU'VE HAD THE CAR FOR 6 MONTHS AND YOU'RE JUST NOW HITTING 1000 MILES?!?!
They're designed to run up to redline but that doesn't mean that's where you should run them. Running an engine at redline all the time will lead to early death of a lot of things. Especially a turbo. Run a turbo hard and you'll be putting a new engine in it at 100,000 miles. Be nice to your engine and only use redline when you need it you'll get 200,000 to 250,000. Normally aspirated engines can last 500,000 miles plus if maintained and treated well.
quote:
Sergeant Blindy was listening to Cher while typing:
Side note: YOU'VE HAD THE CAR FOR 6 MONTHS AND YOU'RE JUST NOW HITTING 1000 MILES?!?!
I know, I have no where to go. 
I expect this to change next year when I can actually drive to school.
Also, I am now aware there will be no super charger for the XRS engine because of its high compression ratio.
Still, I'd like to get some TRD parts like the cold air intake and possibly exhaust.
For my car, the speed governor is likely 138mph. Other XRS owners have hit that. In 5th gear. At 7000RPM. [ 05-21-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
Peter stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
What Type of truck do you drive?, I normally shift my F-150 at 2500-3000rpm, little bit higher if I am raceing, but then I only get 3 speeds, never use granny gear cept when towing.As for the car, My dad taught me rule of thumb about 3000, reving it up any higher really a waste of gas unless your raceing the thing--I imagine some were in the owners manual it will tell you the area the car was designed to shift from.
I own a Nissan 4-cylinder. The manual says to shift at 3300-3600 RPM (it gives speeds for each gear which happen to fall in that range) but northern New Jersey, and especially where I live, is very hilly, so I usually push it to 4 grand to compensate for that.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
I would be shifting at 4k if my car didn't have as many issues as it does. But for being 20 years old, it could still take it after I get the bad stuff fixed (bad transmission = no go go). And my guess is you never drive it WOT, give that baby some gas and see if you can handle it.
I'm in the near same boat as Waiz though. I've had my car for 3 months right now and only just put 1k miles on it. After I stopped giving my freeloading friends rides home the number of miles I put on my car per week dropped by half heh.
That manual transmission is ment to be fun and give your car an edge in performance and fun, take that edge!
quote:
Where's Waisz? had this to say about Knight Rider:
My manual just says where to shift. 15mph for 1-->2, 25 for 2-->3, 40 for 3-->4, 45 for 4-->5, and 50 for 5-->6.
Yeah, throw that out. You have an atypically high-revving car. And it's a Toyota motor, so it'll never die. I recommend you sow your wild oats and take advantage of your engine's potential.
Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith
quote:
BetaTested had this to say about Captain Planet:
Run your car for some fun man. You've got a 4 banger with more horsepower and potential than my 4 banger BMW. (105hp stock, 20 years ago with a busted head gasket). You've got a 120hp stock engine with an 8k RPM redline, at LEAST shift at 4k.I would be shifting at 4k if my car didn't have as many issues as it does. But for being 20 years old, it could still take it after I get the bad stuff fixed (bad transmission = no go go). And my guess is you never drive it WOT, give that baby some gas and see if you can handle it.
I'm in the near same boat as Waiz though. I've had my car for 3 months right now and only just put 1k miles on it. After I stopped giving my freeloading friends rides home the number of miles I put on my car per week dropped by half heh.
That manual transmission is ment to be fun and give your car an edge in performance and fun, take that edge!
Yeah, I just wanted to be sure that I was ready for the car and it me. And actually, my engine is the 180HP model.
I've read that once you hit 6000RPM and the engine "lifts", you never go back. So, we'll see how this turns out. 
It looks like a TRD Cold Air Intake would set me back about $200 with the right seller. Add in maybe $100 for installation and it doesn't seem too bad for some extra bang out of the engine, right?
I've looked at some guides, and it seems I might be able to do it on my own, but I'm afraid of breaking precious warranties. [ 05-21-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
quote:
ACES! Another post by Ninok:
You made a comment about a Toyota Warranted Supercharger, speaking from experience, toyota uses Turbo's. You can most likely use the stock turbo the Celica GT-S AWD model uses. And you will have to get it installed by a Toyota tech to have it warranted. I can't be for sure on this. Also speaking from experience, once you Turbo/supercharge a car that wasn't sold with it, but you can buy other models with it, the warranty is no longer valid.
Whoa there, hold on a minute. The Celica GT-S is FWD... it has a high-revving son of a bitch 1.8L engine, N/A of course.
And for the greater good let me list a few things you shouldn't do if you are not pretty familiar with modifying cars (or your car in particular):
1. Use Forced Induction (Turbo/Superchargers)
2. Use Nitrous (NOS/Zex/NX)
3. Install your own performance modifications
4. Rely on your car manufacturer's "own aftermarket parts company". For example, TRD, NISMO, etc. A lot of the time you'll find other companies to be cheaper and you get the same product. Take an AEM cold air intake. It'll probably run you cheaper because you can order it online. And unless you're overly worried about your car's warranty (which I believe any intake would void anyhow) who cares!
Finally, since I know you're the kind of guy who, like me, wants to know not only if something is possible, but if not, why.
Soooo, let me tell you (very simply) why forced induction is a BAD THING for your particular engine. Like the Celica's 1.8L high-revving son of a bitch you have a very high compression ratio.
Let's look at a (stock) turbo Supra with a 2JZ-GTE engine. Its compression ratio is 8.5:1 making it a good match for FI. When you're boosting, you want a lower C/R because you're not sucking in air from your intake anymore, now your air is coming from a HUGE TURBINE pushing somewhere between 7 and 10psi, or more! Since the air is already quite compressed, a lower compression ratio yeilds more power with boost, and will help the engine last longer. Running a lot of boost with a high compression ratio will be pretty inefficient, as your blow-off valve will be releasing a lot of the pressure before it gets to your intake manifold. The reason for this is that your cylinder can only hold so much air. With a lower C/R you have the ability to take in more air. With a high C/R, the BOV has to do a lot of work because since you're compressing what does come into the cylinder so much, less can be taken in.
HOPEFULLY you're still with me here...
Now let me tell you why your Matrix's 2ZZ-GE engine is poor for boosting (this is an easy one). You displace 1.8L to the Supra's 3. Your compression ratio is a staggering 11.5:1. Keep in mind here my favorite car the Honda Prelude makes 200hp and 156 ft./lbs of torque from 2.2 liters, and its C/R is 10:1. In order to even consider putting any sort of FI onto your engine, you would have to find a way to lower your compression. Pretty much a pain in the ass.
Hope I helped with your forced induction questions, if you have any more ask away! This is like, the only thing I know anything about so I enjoy talking about it [ 05-22-2003: Message edited by: Jaggedpine Mistwalker ]
But boost levels are controlled by the waste gate, not the blow off valve, the blow off valve keeps the pressure in your turbo-> intake tubing low between shifts, when the compressor is still compressing air, but the engine isn't taking any. It protects your turbo and your engine. Also, lowering your compression is easy, you can 1) get different pistons with a dish'ed top, 2) put on a thick head gasket, or 3) have your head ported and polished to lower compression.
quote:
Where's Waisz? attempted to be funny by writing:
It looks like a TRD Cold Air Intake would set me back about $200 with the right seller. Add in maybe $100 for installation and it doesn't seem too bad for some extra bang out of the engine, right?I've looked at some guides, and it seems I might be able to do it on my own, but I'm afraid of breaking precious warranties.
If you pay someone else to install an INTAKE for you, i'm going to drive out to where you live and kick your ass.
So, the general consensus is that I should just go with a reliable CAI and install it myself, then say "screw the new parts warranty?"
A lot of people on Matrixowners seem to be raving over torque braces, too. What's the sane/clear view on these? [ 05-22-2003: Message edited by: Where's Waisz? ]
Also, you will NOT VOID YOUR WARRENTY by installing aftermarket parts, UNLESS the dealership can prove (in court, if neccessary) that the part you installed caused damage to the part that you are trying to replace. I forget the name of the case but back in 1971 there was a big court battle over exactly this and that is what the judge decided, and it's been the precident ever since.
Lets say you put in a cold air intake, you voided the warenty on the intake, and possibly the mass air flow sensor that goes inside the intake, since you could have damaged it putting it in. Thats it. the rest of your engine is still warrentied. If your brakes go out, they still get replaced, if your engine blows up... well put the OEM intake back on before you take it in for service, but it would still get replaced.
As a side note, an intake is the safest and easiest thing to install on a stock car. You should have absolutely no fear in doing it. [ 05-23-2003: Message edited by: Sergeant Blindy ]
