Be human, start an alter right away, and gang-repair it with the other 4 peasants
Make the hero asap, arch mage probabaly, and then charge him right to the enemy
Blizzard or Water Elemental... not sure which would work better
With the elementals, you could pump 3 of them out and just trash his farms to prevent him from getting a hero, since his alter wouldn't even be built yet
I am thinking it could work, because he would have NOTHING to defend, you could blizzard his peasants into dust while he is still trying to get some buildings
Could be the cheapest tactic sinced tower rushing, or it could bomb
No war3, or I would try it myself 
If you know what race your opponent is, you go blizzard on orc, human, and undead, and water elemental on night elf.
And no loss
I am thinking it can be rather successful, you could do a lot of damage with only peons able to stop you
quote:
•Delidgamond• was naked while typing this:
[QB]It's been done. Water Elementals do 35% damage to buildings.QB]
Yes, as do all units that do piercing damage
Heh
But even then, they tend to dish out some impressive damage given time
Which you would have a lot of, heh
Just a thought
The blizard to the peons that early could hurt a whole bunch though
Orc would have the easiest way to stop this though
Just did it on that Legends or whatever map. I couldn't rush him as fast as I wanted to, but let's just say the time he was idle with his peasants, he was talking about how much a fag I was.
quote:
Bajah had this to say about pies:
Hey Vorago, go read that damn story you ASKED FOR BEFORE I KILL YOU AND HAVE NEM ANALLY RAPE YOUR CORPSE.
Ouch
Actually I just finished reading the story and then refreshed this thread to see this post
Excellent story, heh
So don't expect quick responses after the half hour or so I'm on
But thanks for actually writing the story for me
quote:
Skaw stumbled drunkenly to the keyboard and typed:
Undead start-ghoul rush their peasants!
"Can't someone else do it?"
"That's it, I'm dead."
"Help, help, I'm being repressed!"
More cheese!
Thinking about your posts
(and billing you for it) since 2001
By the time you gang repair your altar, and get the archmage out, and next to his base in Plunder Isle, he will have 2 footmen and more making.
Lately, I've been losing, though. I hate it when I forget part of my build order. 
quote:
Fizodeth was naked while typing this:
Note: This does not work on the computer.By the time you gang repair your altar, and get the archmage out, and next to his base in Plunder Isle, he will have 2 footmen and more making.
That's because the compter does the exact same thing. EVERY TIME the computer speeed builds something. Usually its barracks. It gets it out fast, and has a few footmen waiting for its hero, so it can start the creep killing fast.
I think everyone makes an alter first after they've played the game a little.
Altar -> farm -> barracks -> farm etc...
quote:
Reynar attempted to be funny by writing:
Hero rushes like that don't work unless the person is a newbie.I think everyone makes an alter first after they've played the game a little.
Altar -> farm -> barracks -> farm etc...
Yeah, but very few people gang-repair their altar to make it insanely fast building
quote:
Giantt had this to say about Cuba:
Yeah, but very few people gang-repair their altar to make it insanely fast building
Yes, which is why you can usually just let 1 peon do it and you'll get your hero out in time. If you lose, hopefully you have pumped out enough peons to 'call to arms' and just smack the hero down.
Remember, call to arms makes them footmen with less HPs, great for saving ones life =)
Here's the problem with the hero rush:
Item/Build Time
---------------
Altar/60s
All Barracks/60s
Orc Burrow/50s
---------------
All Heroes/55s
Footman-Archer/20s
Ghoul/18s
Grunt/30s
Water Elemental cooldown/20s
Ok, let's say you 5 peasant assist build your altar. You're broke as hell, have pulled in no money, no farms, no barracks, and you're full on supply(5 peasants+hero=full). But, you finished your altar in 12 seconds. So you start up your archmage. 55 seconds later, he's done. Assuming no time whatsoever for clicking(You're fast. REAL fast.), you have a 67 second hero.
You send him courageously at the enemy base, alone but proud. A map like plunder isle takes(guesstimation) about 15-25 seconds to get to the other base. I'll use 20 seconds for our sake.
So(We'll try this with a human opponent first), 87 seconds, and you're in his base. But a normal build(non-orc) allows a player to build all three of his starting buildings(Altar, barracks, farm) with minimal mining requirements. Assuming he started either his barracks or his altar at the very beginning of the game, and began to pump out units at first opportunity(If we assume he's slow, or stupid, this whole argument is pointless. We're looking for a strategy that works against good players.), he'll have his hero out by 115 seconds, or a footman out in 80 seconds, another footman at 100 seconds, and yet another at 120 seconds.
At 120 seconds, you've been in his base for 33 seconds, not enough time to kill a farm, but it doesn't matter anyway because his hero was on it's way before you got to his base. You might be able to kill a footman or two before his hero pops out, but you're not going to do all that much damage. You've got two water elementals out, but you're at about(mana regen of 1 per 2 seconds, started with 285, spent 250, 33 seconds to regen, I'll round up) 52 mana, so you're not getting another one anytime soon. Meanwhile, you haven't got much going yet in your base, he just drove off your attack(Any of the three heroes could do this easily with a footman or two for help), and he should be able to out-economy you easily. If he's good, you lost the game.
This works quite the same if he is Undead. Undead almost ALWAYS build a crypt immediately, and ghouls as soon as the crypt completes(Gotta have that wood...), that's a 78 second ghoul, he now has two, and another one every 18 seconds. You can't really attack his acolytes(he can just run the one you attack around, and two ghouls will take down the water-fiends rather quickly, and he has a hero coming at 115 seconds as well, probably a Dreadlord. The water rush doesn't work.
NE can always fuck your rush my detonating a wisp on the hero and the elemental, draining the mana for the second elemental out of the hero, and dealing 150 damage to waterboy(Yes, he's a summoned unit. That doesn't mean he doesn't have feelings.). But not everyone thinks of that(What? Why would I sacrifice a wisp that's just gonna get killed anyway?). But he still has an 80/100/120 second archer, which can kite waterboy around rather nicely, and a hero at 115. In emergency, a building can always get up and spank waterboy rather harshly.
Orc. They WILL have a burrow up. That pretty much fucks the whole thing. They have a 90 second grunt(This can be hard, as the horde is so pleasantly blessed with a 20 wood shortage at game start), or a 115 second hero. One or the other will/must be delayed, unless he has a partner who likes tho share.
As soon as he gets a hero out, you're fooked.
There. I'm done. If you have any questions, complaints, or you just feel the need to yell at me, go right ahead.
[edit]I dun spel gud[/edit] [ 08-06-2002: Message edited by: Inferno_Spirit ]
quote:
This one time, at Sentow camp:
Actually, a Human Town Hall gives you 12 supply, so while you co-op build an Altar, you could train two more Peasants. You'll have enough resources to build a Farm, even with the co-op, and the second Peasant can start gathering.
I wasn't sure about the supply at the time, and I notcied that it gave 12 in a game I played just a bit later. The other thing I'm curious about is exactly how much money do you burn doing co-op? I assume that fully co-oping a building will basically doublke it's cost, but I guess I'll have to test to find out.
Either way, it kind of fooks your economy.
That, and rushing is one of the most uninteresting ways to play a RTS. It's the same idea as people who use hacks. They are ruining the game before it can really begin. Why play, if they don't want to play?
quote:
Delphi Aegis had this to say about pies:
It takes as much resources to co-op a building as it would to repair it. Gold only buildings only cost gold, so that's a plus..
Then how much money does it cost to repair a building, exactly?
I know the ratio of gold to lumber in the cost of the building stays the same when repairing, but in order to, say, repair a 300/100 altar at 50% life, how much gold and lumber is spent? [ 08-06-2002: Message edited by: Inferno_Spirit ]
Although we've all pretty well established that I suck at this game, I do know that if you plan to use an Arch Mage, who can solo low level Creeps pretty easily, the tactic does give you a slight edge in the opening minutes.
