As many of our munchkin players point out, there is a problem with the ranger. And that problem is: A Ranger is not worth playing past 1st-level.

Harsh as it may be, it is true. Rangers get their best abilities (two-weapon fighting and track) at 1st-level. Unbelievable as it may be, Favored Enemies and Spells aren't really worth pursuing a Ranger to their highest levels. This becomes very true in the face of such abilities as the Monk's and Druid's.

Ergo, the solution is to give greater reason to play a Ranger.

I have created a list of abilities that would both suit the role of a Ranger as well as give them greater appeal to the masses. They are as follows:

Abilities marked with an asterik denote they are prototype and may not fit the model of a Ranger, or they may need testing/opinions.

Non-Unique Abilities: These abilities are already common to some other classes, but would fit a Ranger well.

Save Changes: In order to further distinguish the Ranger from a Fighter, he advances the same rate on his Reflex saves as a Rogue as well as his normal Fortitude advancement.

I've also been thinking of giving Paladins the Will save advancement of a cleric.

Woodland Stride and Trackless Step: Given a) a Ranger's familiarity with the wilderness and b) their close kinship with druids, I feel these two druidic abilities would greatly compliment their arsenal, as well as fit from a role-playing standpoint.

Woodland Stride is the ability to move through undergrowth (briars, thick underbrush, etc) without movement penalty. And Trackless Step speaks for itself.

Uncanny Dodge: We've always thought of Rangers as light, mobile opponents capable of great feats of agility. I feel it would compliment a Ranger greatly to give them the ability to never be flanked and never be caught flat-footed.

I do not include the third evolution of uncanny dodge, which is a bonus to saves against traps, as a Ranger would not have much experience with such mechanisms.

Evasion*: It may or may not make sense. Opinions?

Venom Immunity*: On one hand, a Ranger would be familiar with venomous creatures of the world. On the other, he may not have supernatural ties to be immune to them. Opinions?

New Abilties: These are abilities created by me with the thought of a greater appeal to the players. They are highly subject to testing.

Greater Enmity: The Ranger's hatred/expertise of his Favored Enemies results in this ability. When fighting his Favored Enemies, he gains a +1 competence bonus to his AC and his damage bonus affects creatures normally immune to them (such as undead and constructs).

Superior Tracking: The Ranger gains a +2 to +5(?) bonus to his tracking checks, and can now track creatures normally untrackable (such as those who use Trackless Step or Pass Without Trace), albeit at a penalty.

Uncanny Sense: The Ranger's sharpened senses and keen alertness of his surroundings have resulted in one of his most powerful abilities: to be aware of almost everything around him.

He can become aware of all enemies within a 10-50(?) ft. radius with a successful Spot or Listen check. He is also never caught by surprise.

Advanced Two-Weapon Fighting*: This ability is intended to give Rangers an edge in the Two-Weapon Fighting business. Though it may be overkill, and definitely ( definitely ) needs more work.

The ability is to give the Ranger the option to use two weapons of the same length at the same penalty as using two weapons of different sizes, or two weapons of different sizes at no penalty.

OPINIONS DIRELY NEEDED

So there you have it. Opinions from all D&Ders are welcome and extremely encouraged

Giving the ranger fast-progressing saves in both FORT and REF makes sense, so long as they are not also getting the fast-progressing WILL save. No class should progress quickly in all three of its saves. (Do not give the paladin more power. Too many people munchkin paladins as is.)

Woodland stride and trackless step are both appropriate to the ranger, though trackless step should be gained at a higher level for the ranger than for the druid. Uncanny dodge is also appropriate to the ranger, though at a higher level than the rogue gets it (as with trackless step for the druid).

I'll have to address Evasion when I have my books in front of me.

Don't give venom immunity to the ranger in and of itself. Unless the ranger puts training into herbalism, she will not have either the knowledge or the supernatural background to earn this ability.

Use a progression for superior tracking. As with most of the bonuses afforded to monks (ki strike, AC, and unarmed damage), this ability progresses with training and improved understanding of those abilities the ranger seeks to counter.

I don't know if you plan to have the AC bonus for greater enmity stack in the same manner as the attack bonuses on favored enemies do. If you do plan to have this stack, it might be adviseable to reduce the number of favored enemies a ranger gets. If this doesn't stack, then its impact shouldn't be overpowering.

Beware of uncanny sense. This should not be introduced until level 15+, if at all. Though never being caught by surprise is somewhat redundant with uncanny dodge, the ability for a ranger to actually locate enemies around him will be munchkinned to death.
GM: "You hear footsteps."
Player: "I try to sneak up behind the leader."
GM: "What leader? You only heard footsteps."
Player: "Yeah, I heard footsteps and my uncanny sense told me where everyone was. The leader is whichever one moves a lot more or less often than the others."
GM: "And how would you know that?"
Player: "Uncanny sense, duh. I know where they all are, so I obviously know when they're moving."
At the least, it will be a real pain to deal with. If you have it expand in progression, (10 ft radius at one level, then 20, then 30, etc.), you should still not introduce it until at least level 10, and don't let the player get 50 ft clearance until level 18-20.

I'd ditch AT-WF in favor of something more range oriented. The Drizzt image of a ranger isn't what a ranger's supposed to be. I like Lalamile's suggestion of bow-oriented feats instead of this. Let the fighter and monk be experts in melee, while rangers excel in range combat.

Once you've plotted when to give which abilities, compare the resulting table to the monk or druid. If the ranger gets more than either one of them, you'll need to cut it down. After all, the ranger will be getting good combat, limited spells, and special abilities.

There's also nothing wrong with taking out favored enemies altogether, if you feel that the other abilities you offer are more appropriate to a ranger, but find you need to cut something back.

[ 06-04-2002: Message edited by: Ford Prefect ]

quote:

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ACES! Another post by Maelarr:
Though I agree with most of the points Khyron made...

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quote:

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King Parcelan spewed forth this undeniable truth:
As many of our munchkin players point out, there is a problem with the ranger. And that problem is: A Ranger is not worth playing past 1st-level.

Harsh as it may be, it is true. Rangers get their best abilities (two-weapon fighting and track) at 1st-level.

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But getting such good abilities at level 1 justifies thier being imbalanced in the end game

quote:

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Nobody really understood why Maradön² wrote:
But getting such good abilities at level 1 justifies thier being imbalanced in the end game

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By the way, I don't whether you're joking or not, so take it like this:
Serious=

Joking=

[ 06-04-2002: Message edited by: Reyolen ]

My suggestion to a better ranger is check out the Wheel of Time book for d20. Look at the Woodsman class specifically. I feel that is closer to a better ranger, even tho you won't recieve spells. You get track, 6 + INT mod for skills ( which ranger have alot to keep high ), Fort and Reflex focused saves, some Bonus Feats ( useful for all the bow feats ), Partial Improved Initiative, and Woodland Stealth ( bonus to Hide and Move Silently ).

Some addition feats I think a ranger should have are as follows:

Fast Movement ( Ex ): The character has a speed faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet when wearing no armor or light armor ( and not carrying a heavy load ).

Fast Track ( Ex ): When in forests and other natural environments, the -5 penalty to Wilderness Lore checks for moving at normal speed is ignored. The character can track with no penalty for moving at normal speed.

For my Ranger/Fighter, I wish I got the Wheel of Time book earlier. I would be much happier. A Fighter that takes Track as a feat would be better than a straight Ranger of the same level IMO.

[ 06-04-2002: Message edited by: Pharazha ]

Anyway, the Greater Enmity AC bonus doesn't stack. It's a one-time thing, perhaps upgraded to +2 at a higher level. But nothing as ridiculous as +5.

Advanced Tracking may be able to be broken down into little abilities and given progression over time: Track at level 1, Fast Track at level 3, Bonus Track check at level 6, Track Untrackable at level 9, etc.

Uncanny Senses needs more work, I agree, but I originally intended it just for Rangers to be able to locate all enemies as possible. Example: if they hear footsteps and make a successful Listen check, they realize by the light-falling sound of the footsteps that there are eight Gnolls, and they've been surrounded. Nothing more.

The warrior gets lots of feats, the barbarian gets HP and rage, monks do lots of damage and do freaky things and thieves never die. Rangesr hit for lower damage, and get nothing good past level 1

You might also want to consider giving them the ability to make type S poison, as they probably would want a way to prevent rabid animals/ insane people from hurting others or themselves without killing them.

Also, to prevent the abuse of the Uncanny Sense ability, You could also make it like rangers get the ability to roll for a Spot/Listen check a second time if they fail the first and not an instant map in their head.

I don't have the book infront of me so I can't exactly read up to see if what I'm saying make sense, I'm going off what I remember from rangers.

[ 06-04-2002: Message edited by: Ferret ]

Level :: Ability
1 :: Ambidexterity & Two-weapon fighting w/ light armor
- :: Track
- :: 1st favored enemy
2 :: Woodland Stride
3 :: 1st greater enmity
4 :: Superior Tracking +1/-10
5 :: 2nd favored enemy
6 :: Uncanny Dodge (against flatfoot)
7 :: Trackless Step
- :: 2nd greater enmity
8 :: Superior Tracking +2/-8
9 :: Bonus Bow Feat
10 :: Uncanny Dodge (against flanking)
-- :: 3rd favored enemy
11 :: Uncanny Sense 10ft
12 :: Superior Tracking +3/-6
13 :: 3rd greater enmity
14 :: Uncanny Sense 20ft
15 :: 4th favored enemy
16 :: Superior Tracking +4/-4
17 :: Uncanny Sense 30ft
18 :: 4th greater enmity
19 :: Bonus Bow Feat
20 :: 5th favored enemy
-- :: Uncanny sense 40ft
-- :: Superior Tracking +5/-2

This applies for however you finally decide to describe the Uncanny Sense ability.

I haven't read the section on Rangers recently, but I think I remember there being some useful feats, and extremely useful prestiege classes.

Feats just to fix problems don't make the Ranger class any more appealing.

And Prestige Classes don't fix the problem, either. The problem, if you'll recall, is having them be able to stand on their own as a class. How is taking a PClass solving that problem?

It's apparent this needs more thought, because looking at Ford's prototype list, it seems a little out of whack to me.

Suggestions?