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Author
Topic: Historical Questions
King Parcelan
Chicken of the Sea
posted 04-04-2002 06:24:17 PM
Recently, I've become a bit of a war buff, and I'd like to know a few things for all you other history buffs out there.

1. Why is there relatively little history and depth on WWI when compared to WWII?

2. What part did the French play in WWI?

3. Were the Japanese ever an official part of the Axis powers in WWII?

THANK YEW!

Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:28:01 PM
Recently, I've become a bit of a war buff, and I'd like to know a few things for all you other history buffs out there.

1. Why is there relatively little history and depth on WWI when compared to WWII?
More Media, and wider civilian journalism in WW2?
2. What part did the French play in WWI?
Held the Western Front against Germany with the Maginot Line, made to counter Germany's Siegfried Line?
3. Were the Japanese ever an official part of the Axis powers in WWII?

I do not think so...
THANK YEW!

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
Sentow, Maybe
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 06:28:55 PM
1. World War I is generally considered a huge political mess, while World War II is generally considered a valiant crusade against a murderous tyrant.

Which it was, but that's not really the point

History has the best PR firm in the universe.

2. They surrendured.*

3. This is an excellent question. Although Germany declared war on the U.S. after the U.S. declared war on Japan, Japan did seem to have its own agenda.
I'd like to know the answer to this myself.

* Seriously, I have no idea. That's another good questions.

[EDIT] However, I can tell you that France's Maginot Line came after the first World War, and is widely regarded as the most ineffectual border defense in history.

Basically, it was a series of heavily armed bunkers along the easternmost border of the nation, all connected via an ingenious rail system.

But when Nazi Germany invaded France, they literally just walked around the damn thing.

[ 04-04-2002: Message edited by: Sentow ]

Once more into the breach, my friends, once more. We'll close the wall with our dead. In peace, nothing so becomes a man as modesty and humility, but when the blast of war blows in our ears, then imitate the action of the tiger, summon up the blood, disguise fair nature with rage and lend the eye a terrible aspect.
`Doc
Cold in an Alley
posted 04-04-2002 06:29:22 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Jimmy Carter:
Recently, I've become a bit of a war buff, and I'd like to know a few things for all you other history buffs out there.

1. Why is there relatively little history and depth on WWI when compared to WWII?

2. What part did the French play in WWI?

3. Were the Japanese ever an official part of the Axis powers in WWII?

THANK YEW!


1: Your teachers apparently don't care as much about WWI. Its cause was more political, its conclusion more disputable, so some teachers may just avoid the problems by not bringing them up.

2: They were on the side of the Allies, and also served as one of the war's major battlegrounds. Trench warfare did very unpleasant things to eastern France.

3: Yes.

Base eight is just like base ten, really... if you're missing two fingers. - Tom Lehrer
There are people in this world who do not love their fellow human beings, and I hate people like that! - Tom Lehrer
I want to be a race car passenger; just a guy who bugs the driver. "Say man, can I turn on the radio? You should slow down. Why do we gotta keep going in circles? Can I put my feet out the window? Man, you really like Tide..." - Mitch Hedberg
Please keep your arms, legs, heads, tails, tentacles, pseudopods, wings, and/or other limb-like structures inside the ride at all times.
Please submit all questions, inquests, and/or inquiries, in triplicate, to the Department of Redundancy Department, Division for the Management of Division Management Divisions.

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:31:35 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan got all f'ed up on Angel Dust and wrote:
Recently, I've become a bit of a war buff, and I'd like to know a few things for all you other history buffs out there.

1. Why is there relatively little history and depth on WWI when compared to WWII?

2. What part did the French play in WWI?

3. Were the Japanese ever an official part of the Axis powers in WWII?

THANK YEW!


1. Actually, there is a huge amount written about WWI. WWII may have more, but that's because it was a "Great Victory" rather than an embarassing waste of an entire generation. But there's plenty out there on WWI.

2. As usual, the French went tango-uniform fairly quickly. Because Moltke the Younger fucked up the German plan by reinforcing the south, their offensive stalled, and the French were able to hold the line until British reinforcements arrived.

After that, it was bloody trench warfare.

3. Yes, they were. Although the Axis was not really much of an alliance in comparison to the Grand Alliance that opposed them. There was no sharing of resources common strategy on the Axis side.

Hope that helps. Feel free to ask more.

Admit it: this is really for a test tomorrow, isn't it?

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Lalamile
My title doesn't even make sense any more
posted 04-04-2002 06:33:26 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Cuba:

[b]
2. What part did the French play in WWI?
Thats where the entire western war was fought. France was devistated, like half its male population died in the conflict.

Tarquinn
Personally responsible for the decline of the American Dollar
posted 04-04-2002 06:33:32 PM
quote:
Lashanna wrote this stupid crap:

2. What part did the French play in WWI?
Held the Western Front against Germany with the Maginot Line, made to counter Germany's Siegfried Line?

At least this one is wrong.

The Maginot Line was built well after WW1 (1930-40).

Never heard of a 'Siegfried' Line before.

[ 04-04-2002: Message edited by: Tarquinn ]

~Never underestimate the power of a Dark Clown.
King Parcelan
Chicken of the Sea
posted 04-04-2002 06:34:02 PM
Actually, no, I passed World History and American History during my Freshman and Junior years respectively.

Currently, I am taking Government, which isn't nearly as interesting. So, until the judges start fighting the lawyers in trench combat, I ask these questions.

So....what part did Italy play in WWII? They were a part of the Axis, but what did they do? Why did they join?

Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:34:48 PM
Really, I learned a long time ago, the people you go to with questions like these are BloodSage and Callalron...

I feel bad, because I take Political Sciences, and I feel as though I should know this stuff off the top of my head, but, heh, I don't.

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:35:18 PM
[Double Post]

[ 04-04-2002: Message edited by: Lashanna ]

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
Suddar Williams
SUDAR WILAMS
posted 04-04-2002 06:36:30 PM
quote:
Sentow had this to say about Jimmy Carter:
2. They surrendured.

Damn, you beat me to the obvious joke.

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:36:56 PM
Italy joined the Axis because Mussolini idolized Hitler.

Their major role was to drain resources from the Nazis, as the Italians were almost completely ineffectual fighters. Germany had to station German troops to hold Italy.

On the other hand, Italy was in a tough place, since Hitler would have crushed them like a grape if they hadn't joined.

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Il Buono
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend.
posted 04-04-2002 06:37:51 PM
quote:
Bloodsage enlisted the help of an infinite number of monkeys to write:
Italy joined the Axis because Mussolini idolized Hitler.

"Well, now, we're all Fascists!"

'..ciao!'

"Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig."
Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:38:18 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan's account was hax0red to write:
Actually, no, I passed World History and American History during my Freshman and Junior years respectively.

Currently, I am taking Government, which isn't nearly as interesting. So, until the judges start fighting the lawyers in trench combat, I ask these questions.

So....what part did Italy play in WWII? They were a part of the Axis, but what did they do? Why did they join?



They were old sk00l Fascists, headed by El Duce himself and his Stormtroopers (you'd be surprised how many WW2 references are in Star Wars), They were fascists even before Hitler and his crazy Nazi Party thing.

Somewhere around the invasion of Sicily by the Allied Forces, the Italians had Mussolini hung, and hopped in on the side of the Allies for the remainder of the war (smart move on their part).

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 06:41:58 PM
1. Why is there relatively little history and depth on WWI when compared to WWII?

There is plenty of history to WW1, but little depth, I think. WW1 was a major Trench war, and that was about all that happened. In the end, no one actually won the war per se, but the Germans just gave up. World War 2 had much more content to it, and many more battle styles. The Air Plane had been much more developed, as had fire arms and heavy artillary.

2. What part did the French play in WWI?
Well, first Austria declared war on Serbia, and Russia declared war on Austria (Russia was Serbia's big brother) then Germany joined austria, and then France and G.B. Joined Russia. It had a lot to do with the Balance of Power set up 100 years earlier in the congress of vienna. I think that is what it was anyway.

3. Were the Japanese ever an official part of the Axis powers in WWII?

I think that they were, but in reality, they had very little contact with the other powers and didn't do much with them. I think that the only reason that Germany wanted Japan on their side was so that Japan could help to keep Russia Occupied during the war to help the Germans defeat Russia faster.


P.S. The reason that the Maginot Line was so ineffective is because the Germans just walked around it and took the whole line over. This actually fenced the French in even more. The Maginot Line was created after WW1 so that Germany would never be able to cross over so easily again. But it didn't work, instead the Germans just crossed through Belgium and Holland.

Archers Roxxors!

Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:42:41 PM
quote:
Bloodsage had this to say about dark elf butts:
Italy joined the Axis because Mussolini idolized Hitler.

Their major role was to drain resources from the Nazis, as the Italians were almost completely ineffectual fighters. Germany had to station German troops to hold Italy.

On the other hand, Italy was in a tough place, since Hitler would have crushed them like a grape if they hadn't joined.


Yeah, the Italians were pretty awful... North Africa had to be the worst campaign evar.... "Here... you have no water, and inadequite equipment, but, in the name of your Great Nation, march across the deserts of North Africa and engage in combat with the mechanized Allied Infantry..."

Completely forgot the Italian General's name, but he was apparently not too bad of a general, but Mussolini kinda screwed him over...

And BloodSage, I coulda sworn Italy was Fascist before Germany...

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:44:33 PM
quote:
D had this to say about Pirotess:
"Well, now, we're all Fascists!"

'..ciao!'


The Italians were true fascists. The Nazis were National Socialists, which isn't quite the same thing.

Still hyper-nationalistic, but not quite the same.

A funny WWII story:

I can't remember the name of the particular battle where this happened, but . . .

When the Americans landed in Italy, their orders were to advance as quickly as possible, and bypass what enemy they could in an effort to open another front with Germany. So, facing a large concentration of Italian troops, an American commander told his men to create a diversion to make it look like they were about to attack from the west, rather than the east.

His thinking was that he wanted the Italians to concentrate to meet the fake assault while he slipped by.

The Italians fell for the feint, all right, but instead of massing in the west to meet the perceived threat, they all congregated to the east in hopes of avoiding it.

So the poor American attacked into the heart of the Italian formation, and was bogged down in combat for days.

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Il Buono
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend.
posted 04-04-2002 06:46:13 PM
quote:
Bloodsage had this to say about Robocop:
*stuff*

...it was an Eddie Izzard joke, I now feel I have to respond with something intelligent..

I HAVE EIGHT FINGERS AND TWO THUMBS.

"Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig."
Maradon!
posted 04-04-2002 06:46:23 PM
quote:
Lashanna had this to say about Jimmy Carter:
Somewhere around the invasion of Sicily by the Allied Forces, the Italians had Mussolini hung...

From a telephone pole, along with his mistress, while crowds spat and threw rotten vegetables

Sorry, I like to chime in with that interesting little bit every time Mussolini is mentioned, heh.

Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:46:31 PM
For Whom The Bell Tolls...
Good book, if you like Hemmingway... (I do.)

It's not really World War 1 or 2... It's Spanish Civil War...

It also features the author of Wheel of Time as the main character.

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:47:30 PM
Italy was fascist before Germany. But Mussolini liked Hitler, and Hitler thought Mussolini might be useful.
To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 06:49:01 PM
quote:
Italy joined the Axis because Mussolini idolized Hitler.
Their major role was to drain resources from the Nazis, as the Italians were almost completely ineffectual fighters. Germany had to station German troops to hold Italy.

On the other hand, Italy was in a tough place, since Hitler would have crushed them like a grape if they hadn't joined.


Actually I think it was the other way around. Hitler Idolized Mussolini. When Hitler was younger he even tried to get Mussolini's autograph . Although you are correct, Hitler could have crushed Italy if they didn't Join. And the Germans were much better fighters than the Italians. And, of course, after the allies took over Italy, the locals switched sides. I heard that the Allies gave Mussolini over to the people to be judged. I also heard that they literally tore him to peices.

I'm trying to remember, was Patton in WW1 or WW2.

At any rate, this isn't my strongest point. I'm fair at ancient history and ok at Medival. I really excel at Biblical Scholarship, for someone of my age.

Archers Roxxors!

Tarquinn
Personally responsible for the decline of the American Dollar
posted 04-04-2002 06:49:36 PM
quote:
Bloodsage impressed everyone with:
.... and Hitler thought Mussolini might be useful.

Boy, was he wrong!

[ 04-04-2002: Message edited by: Tarquinn ]

~Never underestimate the power of a Dark Clown.
King Parcelan
Chicken of the Sea
posted 04-04-2002 06:50:25 PM
Patton was WWII.

Originally of the North African Theater moved to the European Theater, if I am correct.

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:51:44 PM
I may have the Hitler-Mussolini thing backwards, but I coulda sworn it was Mussolini who really wanted to be buddy-buddy with Hitler.

It was one way or the other.

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:52:18 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan probably says this to all the girls:
Patton was WWII.

Originally of the North African Theater moved to the European Theater, if I am correct.


General George S. Patton Jr., yep, North African then Europe by way of Italy. Operation Torch and all that stuff...

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 06:52:56 PM
I think your right Parc. Probably the reason that I thought WW1 was because I remember seeing a Patton sword that he developed during WW1. I think he did fight in WW1, but didn't really become famous until WW2.

He was the one that thought he was a mighty Roman General in a past life.

Archers Roxxors!

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 06:53:07 PM
Patton and Montgomery were the Allied generals in North Africa.

Rommel, of course, was the primary Axis guy.

I can't remember the Italian guy, either.

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Azrael Heavenblade
Damn Dirty Godmoder
posted 04-04-2002 06:53:45 PM
Patton was WWII.
"The basic tool for manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them." - Philip K. Dick
Lashanna
noob
posted 04-04-2002 06:53:58 PM
quote:
Bloodsage had this to say about Knight Rider:
I may have the Hitler-Mussolini thing backwards, but I coulda sworn it was Mussolini who really wanted to be buddy-buddy with Hitler.

It was one way or the other.


I do KNOW that originally, Hitler idolized Mussolini... He wrote about him frequently, and did, indeed, attempt to get his autograph...

Dad's going to kill you. Really. He is.
King Parcelan
Chicken of the Sea
posted 04-04-2002 06:56:06 PM
Okay, further questions.

1. What years did America become involved in WWI and WWII respectively?

2. What other countries/powers played a part in either war?

3. What, in detail, was the blitzkrieg?

vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 06:56:50 PM
Rommel, the desert fox, if I remember correctly. Or was it wolf?

Archers Roxxors!

King Parcelan
Chicken of the Sea
posted 04-04-2002 06:57:27 PM
Rommel was, indeed, the Desert Fox.
Tarquinn
Personally responsible for the decline of the American Dollar
posted 04-04-2002 07:00:16 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Matthew Broderick:

3. What, in detail, was the blitzkrieg

The German offensive on Poland.
Utilizing new tactics (combined arms), we they could conquer Poland in less than 14 days. (Although the battle was really over after a only few hours.)

~Never underestimate the power of a Dark Clown.
vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 07:03:39 PM
Okay, further questions.
1. What years did America become involved in WWI and WWII respectively?

WW1, I won't garuntee this, but I think either late 1916 or early 1917. WW2 was the following the bombing of Pearl Harbor in 44 I think.

2. What other countries/powers played a part in either war?

Ottoman Empire played a part in WW1, but they didn't do very well. That was also the end of the empire too. It was a serbian assassin that started WW1. But I blame the Archduke more than him. The archduke managed to evade, 6 attacks I think. But then he went back on the same route, and the assassin managed to stumble out of a bar(which he had previously entered because of his first failed attempt to kill the archduke) and promptly shot the Archduke with a pistol. The Irish fought in WW2 (and in WW1, but they weren't independent then). Australia fought in WW2, China was conquered by the Japanese in WW2.

3. What, in detail, was the blitzkrieg?


Blitzkrieg means lightning war, so I would guess that the Germans make fast, short, and very damaging attacks on unsuspecting enemies, then withdraw quickly.

Archers Roxxors!

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 07:05:14 PM
quote:
When the babel fish was in place, it was apparent Mr. Parcelan said:
Okay, further questions.

1. What years did America become involved in WWI and WWII respectively?

2. What other countries/powers played a part in either war?

3. What, in detail, was the blitzkrieg?


1. You'd have to define "involved." We were "involved" in both wars long before we declared war and sent our troops to participate.

2. An interesting side show of WWII is the China-Burma-India theater.

4. Blitzkrieg simply means "lightning war," and was a combined-arms approach to fast mechanized warfare in which dive-bombers served as mobile artillery for tanks. The goal was to blast deep into the enemy's rear areas before he could mount an effective defense, then secure the areas with follow-on forces.

Outrunning one's own supplies becomes a major issue in this type of warfare.

Despite the hype, if one looks closely, one finds that it never really worked as advertised except against thoroughly second-rate powers, like Poland. Had France not dorked up so completely, they had a good chance of fending off the blitzkrieg, as a matter of fact.

To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Bloodsage
Heart Attack
posted 04-04-2002 07:07:30 PM
No offense, vertue, but does December 7th, 1941 ring a bell. "A day that will live in infamy," perhaps?
To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

--Satan, quoted by John Milton

Karnaj
Road Warrior Queef
posted 04-04-2002 07:07:33 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Tron:
1. What years did America become involved in WWI and WWII respectively?

1917 is correct. However, the US entered World War 2 on December 8th, 1941. There was only 1 dissenting vote in Congress to declaring war on Japan.

That dissenting vote came from the first Congresswoman, whose name escapes me at this time.

That's the American Dream: to make your life into something you can sell. - Chuck Palahniuk, Haunted

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. - John Kenneth Galbraith



Beer.

Cap'n Elethi
I'm too sexy for my shirt, too sexy for my shirt...
posted 04-04-2002 07:10:00 PM
quote:
Mr. Parcelan had this to say about Reading Rainbow:
Okay, further questions.

1. What years did America become involved in WWI and WWII respectively?

2. What other countries/powers played a part in either war?

3. What, in detail, was the blitzkrieg?


1. Archduke Ferdinand was assassinated on the 28th of June, 1914, but Germany declared war on France and Russia on August 3rd and 1st 1914, respectively. US troops entered France to assist in June, 1917.

2. In WW1, the Central Powers were German, Bulgaria, Austria-Hungary, and Turkey.

The Allied Powers were Great Britain, France, Russia, Belgium, Italy, United States, Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Serbia, South African, India, Rhodesia, Portugal, Romania, Montenegro, Greece, and Poland.

[ 04-04-2002: Message edited by: Elethi ]

Elethi Rian, A Man Of Many Talents
vertue
Pancake
posted 04-04-2002 07:13:49 PM
quote:
No offense, vertue, but does December 7th, 1941 ring a bell. "A day that will live in infamy," perhaps?

Well, I know that Pearl Harbor was in the 1940s at least. I was just 3 years off.

Landing at Normandy was in 44 wasn't it? I think so. And wasn't that the first "Official" large detatchment of USA soldiers in Europe?

Archers Roxxors!

All times are US/Eastern
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